BSGcast 3.19 – “Crossroads Part 2″ The Real One!
Here it is guys! At last! With another 9 months until we get the cliffhanger resolved, we’ve got some BSG this fall to look forward to in the form of a 2-episode Pegasus-centric BSG-event, but otherwise, we’re hangin’ in the breeze ’til ‘08, gang. In the meantime, there’s lots of BSGcast goodness and YourGeekNews.com fun to come, so keep checking!
March 25th, 2007 at 10:05 am
Pumped for it? I am.
9 Hours & 38 Minutes to go!!!
March 25th, 2007 at 2:22 pm
Yup.
March 25th, 2007 at 2:56 pm
nice to see I’m not alone in counting down
… Hope the finale has something for everyone, esp our fave casters Matt and Nat.
March 25th, 2007 at 4:31 pm
Did I miss something? Are you guys counting the episodes differently? Isn’t “Crossroads Part 2″ the 20th episode in the 3rd season?
March 25th, 2007 at 7:00 pm
Less than an hour left. Someone said on the message board for “Crossroads, Part 1″ that Anders has to be a Cylon because there’s no way he could have survived on Caprica after the attack if we wasn’t. Well, I think several dozen people survived with him, so that’s not a good criterion. I still think he’s a good candidate for the Final Five, though.
Still, discovering you’re a Cylon this time around is going to be so different than before, I think. It’s not like discovering a hidden enemy anymore. The Final Five are different. Being one of them is going to be something strange and mysterious, I think.
And RDM and crew are so good at throwing us curveballs, I wonder if all our speculation is completely misguided. Not that none of our guesses are wrong, but that the answer is going to be to a question we weren’t even asking.
Just over half an hour…
March 25th, 2007 at 8:46 pm
OH MY GODS MATT & NAT!!
HOLY FRAK THAT WAS MY FAVORITE EPISODE SO FAR.
I
March 25th, 2007 at 8:47 pm
I AM SO OVERWHELMED BY THAT EPISODE!!!!
FRAK ME!
March 25th, 2007 at 8:49 pm
INCREDIBLE!! I cried for a good 5 minutes after that episode ended!! I agree with Ryan. This was such an amazing episode. While interesting, I felt that much of season 3 was a little stale and Soap Opera-ish, but it was worth the wait for this episode. The best so far!!
March 25th, 2007 at 9:12 pm
Good Episode… I agree… Two lines of questioning come to mind though…
One how did Starbuck Survive? Is she a Cylon etc… that line of questioning…
Secondly… Does this mean that Nikki is the second Human/Cylon Hybrid? And what differences are there between a Male Cylon/Female Human pairing and a Male Human/Female Cylon pairing? Main point… will that kid become significant… or will Nikki go through similar problems that Hera had to go through?
March 25th, 2007 at 10:00 pm
How about Lee’s monologue during the trial? That was another fine example of great writing coupled with a great performance. Col. Tigh’s statement about living and dying as the man he wants to be gave me chills. Damn fine episode!
March 25th, 2007 at 10:48 pm
omfgs! awesome season finale..i really did not expect kara to come back, not until season 4 at least..tigh, anders, tori, and chief are cylons and choose to be with the humans..awesome speech by tigh, loved how he put it..”you can count on my admiral” tigh says to adama..stating his loyalty regardless of being a cylon..”i’m here if you need me madame president” says tori to roslin..saying she will be there regarless of what she is, she will die for her if it came down to it since she knows she’s a cylon and will just resurrect? i hope so tori in that scene was just incredible..and tigh mentions Ellen..maybe she’s the final cylon..i hope so, i do love her character and wish she comes back!!
March 25th, 2007 at 11:52 pm
Also: Somebody already got to the “All Along the Watchtower” Wikipedia page and indicated that it was the song haunting Sam, Tory, Tigh, and Chief… Crazy BSG fans! My question is why would the Cylons choose to communicate with their sleeper agents through a 1960’s Bob Dylan song? As soon as Tigh said, “Said the Joker to the Thief,” I yelled, “Bob Dylan!! How can they be Cylons if it’s Bob Dylan?!?” I really hope you guys talk about this in your next BSGcast.
And- Is it really Starbuck? I might just be in shock or something, but I have this strange feeling that she’s communicating with Lee from beyond. I’m probably wrong… But I am thinking that if it’s really Starbuck– Anders is already sleeping with Tory and D left Lee. Does this pave the way for Starbuck and Lee to finally be together?
Pariah_Ronin: Maybe Hera and Nikki are meant for each other?
March 25th, 2007 at 11:57 pm
So the song was All Along the Watchtower! How would the cylons even know that song much less use it as a trigger…. unless the cylons have already been to Earth… but they are searching for Earth…. so the final five have been to Earth… but Saul has been around for at least 40 years… which means the human Cylons were around during the first war and he is some sort of left over sleeper agent (maybe #1?)… but that means that at least …. AHHHH BRAIN FRYING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (lets not even mention Karas Viper)
March 26th, 2007 at 12:47 am
Guys, I’m depending on you to make sense of this episode for me
March 26th, 2007 at 2:31 am
They should have used the Jimi Hendrix version for the actual show. That would have really cool.
March 26th, 2007 at 2:49 am
Awesome episode!
Okay so they’re either cylons as the show implies… or part of the five referred to in the Temple of Five, perhaps meant to lead them to Earth, hence the use of a song from Earth. And perhaps Roslin would be the fifth, as she is obviously linked in the search for Earth. Or the final five cylons and those from the Temple of Five are the same thing… or I’m completely wrong about everything.
Do we know that the ships approaching are the usual hostile cylons, or ships full of final fivers, who may or may not be hostile? (And if the four revealed tonight are in fact cylons, were they activated by this possible fleet of final five cylons?)
I can’t even think about Starbucks return, too much to absorb from those last few minutes. I think I need to watch it all again.
March 26th, 2007 at 3:44 am
Best Cast Ever! You guys rock!
March 26th, 2007 at 3:49 am
I was right about all the the characters (except possibly Romo Lampkin, which hasn’t really hasn’t been really told about). Chief Tyrol was kinda a throw off because he had a kid.
Chief Tyrol is ironic to be a Cylon due to the fact his wife Cally is a real frakkin’ racist to Cylons to the point of KKK-ness. My theory on why he is able to have a kid is one of two possibilities: Either Cally slept with another man on New Caprica or it has something to do with the fact that Tyrol is one of the Final Five, which makes him better than the other 7 Cylon models. The fact he is a Cylon however, would explain why he was “compelled” to enter The Temple of Five.
Col. Tigh still confuses me on how he’s a cylon because of the fact he has a real backstory and not just something that’s been programmed. This is of course backed up with the fact that Admiral Adama has been around with Tigh most of their lives. It doesn’t make sense how there’s been Cylons that have looked like humans since before the 1st Cylon War. I hope there will be something that explains this later on in the 4th season.
Anders also has a creditable history. Back on Caprica, he was the Pyramid captain of the Caprica Buccaneers which would mean he grew up playing Pyramid in order to get drafted onto a professional team. This adds a question to whether or not if the Cylon models started out as fully matured humans or did they have to mature and grow?
Tori on the other hand has no real backstory and is only first mentioned after he replaces Billy who gets shot and dies which makes it easier to believe that she is a Cylon. She was a precinct Captain for the Federalist Party in Delphi for five years, according to Battlestar Wiki, but she could’ve just been programmed with a story.
This still leaves the question of who is the last of the Final Five? The possibility of Romo Lampkin being one of them is out there because he does state that he is a good liar when he was talking to Major Adama and then left his cain and began to walk without a limp again.
Since Chief Tyrol had a child, it would be assumed that Hera is not the Hyrbrid baby, which would mean that she cannot be one of the Final Five. It is uncertain on what role Nikki will play on this from here on out. Then again, if you’ve been paying attention, you’d come to realize that these little girls aren’t the only hybrids that have been featured on the show. And just to put it out there, has anyone noticed that all the hybrids that have been shown are female in gender?
Roslin cannot be a Cylon because the scripture’s prophecy describe her as a savior and it seems that the scriptures describe 12 Cylon models as the 12 Lords of Kobol and/or demons.
Starbuck’s return was a joyous feeling and somewhat explainable, but that wasn’t at all how I imagined her return. She too cannot be a Cylon because she described in Prophecy as something else of importance.
The idea of this Re-imagined series is to be a realistic as possible with the obvious Sci-Fi tech twist. I hope that they do not make it so mythical, that impossible things without explanation begin to happen. I know that the prophecy alone is already pretty far out there, but even with that, there is are probabilities and theories of how one can see into future.
March 26th, 2007 at 9:13 am
Lol.. Great job guys.. That definitely made me laugh! Very spaced out..
Anyway, regarding the episode.. Wow! I’m conflicted.. On the one hand I’m excited by some of amazing moments (Lee’s testimony and Tigh saying he wants to die as the man he’s been all this time was chilling!). On the other hand, there were some dissappointments as well. I’m having trouble believing these people are truly Cylons, I felt Starbucks return was somewhat heavy handed and I was veeery dissappointed we didn’t at least get to see SOME shooting before the season ended.. It’s great the Cylons are back and it’s good they appear to be a menace again, but there was absolutely NO shooting!
In any case, the wait is going to be excruciating.. Good thing the DVD’s and the Soundtrack will be out by mid-August (Bear McCreary’s website), with the Direct-to-DVD movie coming out towards the end of the year..
Anyway, now I can focus my attention on Rome, Lost and perhaps look up a few other shows as well.. What will you guys be doing during the hiatus?
March 26th, 2007 at 10:02 am
Wow, that blew my mind. I am still in shock.
Each episode since Kara’s “death” has been an emotional grinder.
I almost crapped my pants when Sam etc. started showing up in the empty room together….I could not believe RDM was actually revealing Cylons to us after all the suspense. It was good (especially Tighe’s comment about living and dying as the man he wants to be). However, I would have liked to have seen a little more anguish and shock and disbelief that they were Cylons. Like maybe Sam screaming “I am not a Cylon! I AM NOT A CYLON” and Tyrel screaming “YOU ARE A CYLON! YOU ARE A CYLON!” and then them all screaming to drown out the truth and then collapsing on their knees with the weight of the realization. Then the alert sounds….
In short, I think the scene could have had a lot more emotional impact.
I was surprised when the trial ended 1/3 of the way in to the episode, but I guess it had gone on long enough. Lee’s speech was incredible. How could anyone convict Baltar of what he did when everyone’s hands were dirty; Lee was so bang-on.
It all comes back to are we worth saving? Yes, we do terrible things, but we also can do just and admirable things too. “It’s not enough to just survive. We have to be worthy of survival.” All the same, there was a good chance in my mind that he would be found guilty and someone would save him before he was executed.
Roslin is connected through dreams to Six and Athena, two Cylons….interesting. But she has been tested by Baltar’s detector and is surely not one. Same with Adama. Who is the final Cylon? I have no idea.
Was Kara just a vision of Lee’s? I hope not. I hope she is real and really did find Earth.
Waldopiehead – Nicky is a boy (Tyrel and Callie’s child).
I loved the ending. Made you realize that we are all in some insignificant part of the galaxy, living out our small lives…..but I realized later, RDM is clearly saying with that ending that the music ’signal’ was coming from Earth because the music got louder as the screen zoomed out to Earth. This means that there are Cylons there, or there were Cylons on Earth a long time ago.
It’s hard to say whether Sam, Tori, Tighe and Tyrel were created as adults or as children, but they did say in the meeting that “We have been from the start.” So that settles that. Which means that Tighe has, yes, been around for at least 50 years.
I am a little disappointed to see who the Cylons are. I guess I am still in shock. I wish Tighe wasn’t one. That sucks somehow, even though I am sure he will remain the good person he is. I just loved him as a fallible human though. But I guess now he’s a fallible Cylon!
I think they will come clean with their identities as Cylons and the humans will accept it. That will be interesting, especially to see Callie’s reaction to Tyrel and Adama’s reaction to Tighe being one.
I think the Cylon ships that appeared at the end will be full of the their replicas – “good ones.” I think there was a splitting off of good and bad Cylons (bad seven vs. good five) a long time ago. And some of the seven have gone good now as well. There will therefore be a Cylon civil war of some kind…this could be interesting as Cylons on our side would have insider knowledge of how to destroy the bad ones, but the bad Cylons would know this. The only bad Cylons are Six (except one of them!), doctor guy, PR guy. Leoben, Sharon, D’Anna and the final four are good (so far.)
Where the heck will the show go over the next 22 episodes? THAT’S A LOT OF STORY! They can’t reach Earth or the show would be over, or would it?
March 26th, 2007 at 10:07 am
Whats up with the 3 women who took Baltar? everyone seems to be forgetting that one.
March 26th, 2007 at 10:43 am
Matt & Nat, I didn’t think anyone could express what I was feeling after last night, but you two have summed it up.
Here’s a link to an interview with RDM posted just this morning.
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07085/770732-352.stm
It pretty much torpedoes the notion that any of this was a fake-out. The Fab Four, or ATT&T, or The Watchtower Gang (or whatever we’re going to call them; we really should hold a vote), REALLY ARE CYLONS. Whatever that means now. Someone has a great theory on the forums that they’re more guardians than anything, either protecting the Humans from the other Seven, or trying to lead both the Humans and the Seven to a common destiny.
And yes, Starbuck is really back. Called it. Along with pretty much everybody else.
Buck up, guys. We can all make it through this together. *Sniff*, *choke*, *gasp*…
March 26th, 2007 at 10:54 am
it think its wrong to assume that all 12 of the cylon models were created at the same time. it seems clear to the me that the “final five” are actually the “first five” which would make it possible that someone like tigh to be a cylon. and i don’t think these cylons are in anyway “sleeper agents” like boomer was; these five (or four, as there’s one left to be revealed) have no connection with the other seven models, so it would make sense that they are either a)operating under their own agenda or b)don’t even have an agenda because they’ve just become aware of their true nature.
March 26th, 2007 at 12:32 pm
On the episode when, Helen is back, Baltar said that every one is this room is human, and as I remember well, Roslin, Adama, Helen and Saul are there. I got a theory on how the seven models might be identified as differents of the humans amd on the other hand why the finals five can’t. To be able to breed with humans, it mean the cylons are of the human species, if they wheren’t it would appear on Hera and Nikki. The only thing that I see different and witch can make a significative different is the time of growth. To have so many clones of each model they must have used some way to increased the growth speed. Also, Tigh, Tyrol and Anders have a background story that indicated that they had been around for a while, more than forty years for Tigh. So they could have grown up by the natural way witch can explain why Baltar didn’t identified Tigh as a cylon.
March 26th, 2007 at 12:49 pm
First time saying something so hold on. One of the best season finales in TV history. I was just blown away with how much they put into one hour. But if you think about it the with the Watchtower that the 4 are watching some of the more important people on Galactica they are watching them keeping them safe. Tigh is washing Admiral Adama. Tyrol is for Galactica, the vipers, the pilots and maybe even Lee. Anders is washing Starbuck. And Tori is for keeping the Roslin safe. Also something maybe the final 5 are earlier models or on of a kinds Tigh may even be 1 the first attempt left as a baby or a young adult. As for the dream in the opera house there was 4 in it Roslin, Athena, 6 and Hera. When Roslin and Athena figured it out Hera was also crying in the sickbay. Just some thing to think about.
March 26th, 2007 at 1:08 pm
Well, I’d hoped beyond hope that Starbuck was going to come back; But now that we’re stuck waiting until 2008 I’m not sure if I can take it!
Although being able to see ya’lls reactions have eased the pain a little bit. I think visually the Season Finale was just amazing! So many really pretty CG shots of the ships and then the rapid pull back to finish the episode was breathtaking.
And the first time using Lyrical Music in english for the soundtrack of the episode.
Ah! This show is epic! RM loves to mind frak us all!
March 26th, 2007 at 2:21 pm
Great episode! Captivating from start to finish. The scene with Lee in the witness box was just wonderful – and went a long way in helping us understand just what motivated Lee to make the choices he made – guilt! I also loved the understated way in which the Final Five (minus 1) all reacted as they all recognised they were Cylons – personally, I think screaming and hystrionics would have taken away from the weight of the scene.
Like all good cliff hangar endings, it left us with lots of questions:
Who is the final One? Is Starbuck really back, or is she more of a phantom? After all, her ship looked pristine and she did seem to be surrounded by that glow of perfection that screams “not of this world” anymore. If she really is back, is she a Cylon? How did she get get to earth? Are we going to see some kind of Cylon civil war? How will the new Cylons “come out” – and how will their nearest and dearest take it? Will Caprica 6 manage to shake off those shackles? What’s up with Roslin and her Cylon telepathy? Is she a Cylon? How did Tyrol manage to father a child as a male Cylons? Do Cylons like Bob Dylan?
Oh so many question, and so much time to wait.
I think RDM et al need to do something more to make Anders and Tori more interesting, because, at the moment they’re just not very interesting, even as a Cylon Tori is a bit of a non-character. I just don’t care enough about their characters. Thinking back to the first and second series, one thing that kept me watching was my interest in the Boomer/Valeri/Number 8 plotline. As for the other two, Tigh will clearly have to reconcile his Cylonophobia with the fact that he is a Cylon, and the Chief, well he’s just such an honest upright guy and a very lovable character that I can’t wait to see what happens with him.
I thought it was interesting the way that Tigh and Tori both looked at each other as they took up their positions again beside the two most powerful people on the battlestar. I’m not sure if it was just about loyalty – surely, there was some hint that they had not just arrived in these positions by accident. (Imagine if one of the Final Five had turned out to be Roslin’s hair stylist. It wouldn’t have had the same punch).
March 26th, 2007 at 2:51 pm
Awesome BSGcast! You guys wrapped up just how I feel! Can’t wait to see what you do when your “technical difficulties” are over.
March 26th, 2007 at 2:56 pm
lmao hilarious video guys!
I think if we are gonna go with the Five Guides from the Temple of Five, then it would be Starbuck, not Roslin.
March 26th, 2007 at 2:58 pm
OMG!! That was a great episode, not a normal season end. But great.. AND STARBUCKS BACK!!!! (maybe) WOOOHOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!
March 26th, 2007 at 4:48 pm
Laughing my damn ass off at the pre-cast guys. The juxtaposition of your reactions was fantastic and made even better by the editing to speed Nat up. Nicely done. A+ … you’re gonna do more casts after you’ve finished the finale one? Pretty please with nebulas and sexy cylons on top
(sorry to get carried away. BSG finale will do that to you)
That ending was very reminiscent (I imagine on purpose) of “You Can’t Go Home Again” and here again Lee discovers that it’s Starbuck in the pilots seat. Heee! and speaking of Starbuck OH YEAH my favorite all time character (transcending tv and film) is back. My heart was pounding wildly in my chest, trying to burst past my ribs as her then unknown ship showed up on Dradis. EEE omgs, that face that awesome trademark smile and chuckle. Still very much Starbuck just unfettered, free and with a look of pure clarity.
I’m so happy all those overt clues RDM dropped, particularly in Maelstrom, that pointed to her return all turned out to be true. The way I always figured it he never intended for her to stay gone he just put her death in to give Maelstrom more of an impact, which FRAK did he ever achieve. But they’ve been going on about her destiny for so long now and things like alluding to Aurora in Maelstrom were proof positive that she’d be back. It actually saddens me that people think that RDM didn’t have the balls to actually kill Starbuck, it was never about that. All you have to look at to know that is all the other deaths which were fitting and or alluded to. Starbucks destiny was to guide the fleet to earth, not to provide an arrow, both literal and figurative, but to be the ONE who physically lead them. That she’s actually been to Earth blew my damn mind and I’m all the happier for it, it sure adds a whole other wow level.
I would hope that anyone calling bs on her being actually being back would at the very least look back on Maelstrom, listen to all the things that were said, pertaining in particular to destiny and it will be apparent that that destiny was not to die. I promise it’s there, I’ll hold myself personally accountable to that. While I being bolder than I usually am I’ll venture that Starbuck saying “It’s really me” is meant literally that she is very much real, not a vision Lee is having, and very much human…
The four cylon reveals we so well executed to have them all convene in that one room (the gym) and how some were quick to denial others to acceptance, other to shock. Again the levels were awesomely well played out. I especially love both Tigh and Tory renouncing affiliation with cylon kind and pledging allegiance to humanity’s cause. Super cool
That CIC scene where the two devote themselves ever more fervently to their respective leaders was perfect. Oh, and the look between the two of them. *is dead* Ever since Six said to Baltars that they don’t speak of the other 5 cylons I was intrigued by what that mean other than knowing thye were different from what we knew of Cylons at that time.
Excellent climax… *goes back to replaying Starbucks return*
March 26th, 2007 at 7:33 pm
BRILLANT!!!!!!!
tears, just tears
of laughter at your vid
of sorrow over a 10 month delay before the inevitable final season
of pain from watching my butterfingers LIE like Jake on the stand
I think I shall have to re-watch this entry each sunday while I wait for 2008
March 27th, 2007 at 12:37 am
The question I have is: had the actor who played Billy not asked to leave the show due to scheduling conflicts and other opportunities, do you think HE would have been one of the final 5 instead of Tori? Personally, I like to think so… perhaps without all the making out with Anders, though…
~Matt
March 27th, 2007 at 2:00 am
Personally, if Billy was still around instead of Tori, I would have been totally fine with him making out with Anders…
Seriously though… I love BSGcast. You guys have been doing a excellent job the past few months, and I’m glad you found me on Myspace. I’m looking forward to your future updates almost as much as the actual BSG show itself.
Cheers from Chicago!
-Greg
March 27th, 2007 at 2:04 am
Personally, I like to think so… perhaps without all the making out with Anders, though…
I dunno… Anders and him getting it on would have been *hot*
*melt*
March 27th, 2007 at 2:51 am
Hilarious!! I have neer replied to a BSGcast episode, but …..2008??!!!! WTH?! Im so mind boggled that a television show can extract such a strong emotional response from me. I am not a television lover, but since BSG came out, I am glued every week to SciFi to have my mind scrambled and my emotions violated. Did any of you notice Roslin right before all the power went out in the fleet. It hit her seconds before it hit the fleet. Explain this to me please.
March 27th, 2007 at 3:52 am
Boy am I glad that we still don’t know, as a matter of hard fact, who are the Final 5 Cylons. We can all speculate till we are blue in the face however that fact has yet to be totally revealed. I just can’t buy Tigh as one of the Final 5. I still have my money on Baltar as the Cylon God, that whole thing with the hood and the women at the end totally reinforced my idea. Did anyone else catch that part in the Opera House with Caprica, Baltar, and Hera? If you look, there were only SIX lit cloaks on the wall and then in the balcony there were the FIVE lit hoods of the Final 5 Cylons. Why were there only SIX instead of SEVEN??? I got the feeling at the end that the Cylon fleet was that of the Final 5 who are the “Good Cylons” and the theory of a Cylon civil war is becoming more and more plausible. Starbuck is signed for next season and she will be a part, however, what part she will play is still a mystery. Her coming back the way she did. just like Anders, Tigh, Tori, and Tyrol hearing the music and being Cylons….it just seems all too easy to me. There is something in the back of my head that is saying, “Don’t forget about Lee.” He has been the closest to everything and everyone important throughout, and if we are to believe that Chief, Anders, Tigh, and Tori are Cylons due to their proximity to The Fleet, Starbuck, Adama, and Roslin, then we must assume Lee is as well since he is right in the middle of everything. Let’s not forget that line by I think Leoben, “Adama is a Cylon.” The Lee line would fit, however it would put my Baltar line to total shambles. Anyway, more to come later. Thanks everyone.
March 27th, 2007 at 6:06 am
I’d say that’s a very safe bet Matt. I agree the Tory/Anders aspect is a good point to counter but I suspect that the goal here was to have it set up so that these particular people were to the forefront in protecting humanity, Tigh and Tory principal amoung them for there direct line of associaton with Adm. Adama and President Roslin respectively.
March 27th, 2007 at 6:58 am
[...] so wie die beiden fhle ich mich auch: BSGcast 3.19 – Crossroads Part 2″ | Battlestar Galactica Und in meinem Kopf trmen sich Fragen ber Fragen. Die grsste und wichtigste Frage ist jedoch: [...]
March 27th, 2007 at 12:56 pm
I think the very last part of the episode where we zoom out from all the fracas and then zoom back into earth was excellent. Now we know there is an Earth. We just don’t know when. It was a great teaser, very expertly done! Just enough to MAKE people come back next year!
Excellent episode. Just because the fab 4 all went to the same room doesn’t mean they are all Cylon. I would probably guess it too, but it might not be necessarily so. Perhaps they just have abilities that normal humans don’t have… I haven’t heard the podcasts or interviews from RDM that might tell us the “truth” but methinks not telling us for sure is brilliant. Keeps the characters and us second guessing themselves.
How could Starbuck not come back?! Just remember, folks, in the words of JMS of B5, “Faith manages.”
cheers!
Jack
March 27th, 2007 at 2:58 pm
First of all let me say great closing shot of the the human and cylon fleets and the camera shot of earth. i’ll definitely be back in 9 months.
Now for my all my questions. If Tigh is a cylon, will they be able to grow him an eye? And what ever happened to the theory that there were 6 male cylon models and 6 female models. With all the revelations in this episode, that would make it 8 male and 3 female. Talk about inequality. Also, at the very least the final model would have to female, eliminating all the remaining male suspects.
As for starbuck’s return, i think she’s going to be Lee’s personal apparation from now on. Queue her punching him in the mouth whenever he says or does something dumb, which will happen a lot.
March 27th, 2007 at 10:00 pm
One should probably consider the possibility that Tigh at least may have been replaced by a cylon, over the years since the first war. In other words, cylons could’ve killed him and replaced him with a lookalike. There’s no reason to assume that the Tigh who knew Adama 40 years ago was the same Tigh in the series.
March 27th, 2007 at 11:16 pm
I’m still not convinced by Anders as a Cylon. All the others are reasonable choice: Tigh have influence on Adama, Tori may have some on Roslin, Tyroll is the head of the workers in entire fleet. And Anders… Somebody mentioned that he is close to Starbuck, but i don’t think that she could be influenced by him. By Apollo maybe if by anybody.
But i don’t agree that it would be difficult to make a pro pyramid player a Cylon. Imagine this: Anders comes to Caprica saying that he was playing in the lower leagues on some other colony and gets a contract with some minor team. Then he is spotted\drafted by Bucaneers and becomes their best player. Makes sense for me.
March 27th, 2007 at 11:47 pm
I don’t think the cylons at the nebula are the “final 5″ models. It makes more sense from the Part 1 setup that they’re the basestars that had been following them and then disappeared. They just realized where the fleet must have been heading and jumped ahead of them to lay a trap. The interesting thing to speculate at is whether or not the loss of power to the fleet ships was part of the cylon trap, or if maybe it was something else. Come January, we may find out that the basestars experienced the same loss of power at the same time as the fleet. That would explain why they didn’t attack while the fleet was helpless.
Assuming RDM isn’t pulling a fast one on us, then we have 4 of the final 5 cylons identified. The interview link that Stroogie gave had RDM telling us they are indeed cylons. Had he not stated this, I would have (and am now) pointed out that these 4 were all on New Caprica during the occupation, and thus could have been either brainwashed or body-snatched then. Ditto for Starbuck and Roslin (Tigh, Starbuck, and Roslin were all shown to be imprisoned for various lengths of time). I personally think that these are the models that were “born” and raised human, perhaps the archetypes from which they might have been later cloned (had they not been sent to live among the humans). Or perhaps they are the only ones to survive/escape being ‘boxed’ as each of their respective models were determined to be ‘defective’ over time. So Tigh was the first to be voted off Cylon Island for being a belligerent drunk… then Tyrol for being a whiney malcontent “throwing his body on the cogs and the levers” and leading a revolt… then Anders for questioning authority and looking too pretty and not being able to hold his liquor… then Tory for not combing her hair enough. Or something. It’s interesting that the cylons (or at least these 4) age like humans.
March 28th, 2007 at 12:17 am
Good points, Nanji… but I really feel like these final 5 cylons are a very different type of Cylon. Not like when Boomer realized she was a Cylon planted in the fleet. These 5 are More eternal than the 7 we’ve met. It seems that these Cylons, or a version of them, were around for the building of the Temple of Jupiter… so whether they are genetically reoccuring beings in the Colonial gene pool, or whether they live and die and are resurrected of their own will as humans, we won’t know for at least 9 more months. But for now, if Tigh can be a man with a history pre-dating the first cylon war, I’m guessing Anders has a good alibi too.
~Matt
March 28th, 2007 at 4:03 am
Matt,
In the interview with RDM from Stroogie’s entry above : http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07085/770732-352.stm, he does refer to the final five as “fundamentally different cylons”.
HOWEVER – he also refers to 6 and 8 as “different fundamentally”.
Also, given D’anna looks of surprise when gazing upon the final five in the Temple of Jupiter, how do we know that she didn’t see 6 and/or 8 in there also – lots of great back story there! (what was Baltar right about?)
Are you sure “Eternal” is the right word? Perhaps “Original” might be more appropriate.
Each “normal model” we have seen so far obviously has many-copies… there must have been originals for this to occur.
And given that Cylon technology is obviously capable of manipulating biological-genetic material into living organisms, surely they have the ability to enable ageing within that technology.
Roll-on Pegasus episodes!!!!!
March 28th, 2007 at 7:40 am
Hmmm, I don’t know Matt. I agree that the final five are of a diffrent breed from the others but as far as them being from the time of the temple of Jupiter… that seems like a stretch. I understand that D’Anna Biers being able to “see” the final five at the temple would seem to indicate that, but lets not forget that with the song “All Along the Watchtower” being the trigger for four of the five it seems that the final five have already been to Earth. Indeed if Starbuck is the last Cylon she even says as much. Given this it would mean that the final five must have followed this route already and could have left a sort of trigger at the temple to reveal themselves to the other cylons should they ever get that far. The main argument I would have against that theory however is the numbering of the cylons. We know there are twelve and so far we know that the numbers go as follows.
1. Unknown
2. Unknown
3. D’Anna Biers
4. Unknown
5. Aaron Doral
6. Caprica
7. Unknown
8. Shaon Valerii
9. Unknown
10. Unknown
11. Unknown
12. Unknown
Now, when you number something you start at 1 and work your way up with each rendition. So using that logic we can see that, as there is no block of five “unknowns” in the list, that the final five must have been intermingled in the creation of the others. This means that the final five are really no older than at least some if not all of the other models and something must have happend to cause them to break off, but not that there distance from the other models is because they are older.
March 28th, 2007 at 9:02 am
Nat, our reactions were eerily similar. I plan on taking up a hobby for the next nine months, something new and completely time consuming. Since I live in New York, I’m also thinking of picketing the Sci-Fi offices… cruel and unusual punishment this is, for such loyal watchers as we are.
As for the rest – I’m still stunned and trying to process it all. I look forward to hearing your thoughts.
jei
March 28th, 2007 at 3:10 pm
HAHAHA! Wow, so funny guys. But really…WHERE IS THE REAL BSGCAST FOR THE EPISODE CAPS CAPS !!!!111
sorry bout that, I love your little show and watch it every day. Tigh soo has my support in Season 4, no matter which side he chooses.
March 28th, 2007 at 3:44 pm
Good point DukeE
RDM only said that the Cylons were not CLONES of anybody. Techincally, the Cylons could have just replaced Tigh with a COPY of him.
March 28th, 2007 at 4:38 pm
Hi BSG fans… first time poster here.
Geoara made a good point in that Diana could have seen one of the cylons we’ve already seen as one of the final five. If that is so, my bet is on Sharon since she’s the one that appears in the dreams to Roslin, Baltar and Caprica, and that would make the numbers 8-12 a block. That would also explain why there are only six white banners in the temple dream sequence, because one of the other regular cylons hasn’t been revealed to us.
I think the song is coming from Earth. In the original series, the crew received a transmission from the Apollo 11 mission I think, so this is probably borrowing from that. I think starbuck was pulled into the cylon raider we saw in Maelsotorm, which either belonged to a different faction of cylons, or to the ship of lights, and the cylon fleet we see in crossraods part II are likely the ship of lights in disguise or a seperate faction for cylons.
Now I think BSG is the best show on tv, and I’m obsessed with it, but season 3 disappointed in many ways. A theory I have is that RDM and collegues are having writers block and have chosen to delay season 4 for so long, so that they can read what the fans are saying and get ideas from them for season four.
What do I want to see in season four. Dowloaded part II. I think showing the cylon ship was all nice and dandy, but I would be interested in seeing more about Boomes rise to be part of the leadership of the cylons. More about her transition from thinking she’s human, to hating them. More about the political power struggle that lead to the culture of unity to rise to power. I also want some answers. Cavil says that cylons beleived they made a mistake and were withdrawing from Caprica, so I’d like to see explanations from both sides. The humans had previously expressed that they wanted to return to their home worlds, so if they are now not occupied, why settle in new caprica or search for earth, why not just return home. If the cylons wanted to leave the humans alone, why did they decide to take over new caprica. We can theorize that it was because some cylons became afraid of humans having revenge and wanted to stablish cylon friendly governments, or that they wanted to convert them to their religion, or it was a break of group that came that wanted to do another experiement. But I want an explanation, and to see the cylon government at work, maybe even see the cylon home world. Also, we now have the cylons looking for earth. Why are they doing it. Just to spite humans, you want that so we want that too. When, how and why do they care about earth, since they have their own world, and 12 colonies they can rule. Again an explanation would be nice. And if they want to find Earth because they withdrew from the 12 colonies why not tell humans, hey we’ll go to Earth and leave you alone, you can have your colonies back.
I hope in season 4 they learn from their mistakes this season, which in my opinion are as follows. No space battles, only one this season really, and though I’m peace loving person in real life, and i do enjoy a good space battle. No Sharon. One of the most intriguing storylines in the first two seasons were that of the two Sharon’s. But not much has happened with them this season. Boomer was almost totally absent this season, and Athena, though she’s had a couple of nice scnenes here and there did not have as compelling a journey this year as the previous years. The next issues only really only apply to episodes 3×06 to 3×15: They really didn’t tackle much of the socio-political climate of our world. One of the great things about BSG is that their sci-fi stories are metaphors for the social, political, and economic issues that affect us in the real world. But those episodes I found were really shallow. I felt I was watching a mixture of grey’s anatomy and the amazing race but set in space. No tension. The cylons did not look like a real threat for most of the season.
That was long winded, sorry about that, but I’ve purged my feelings now, hehe.
Oscar
March 28th, 2007 at 5:31 pm
I think that final five operate in a similar way as Miang Hawwa and/or Elhaym Van Houten from Xenogears, and are perhaps exactly the same thing.
“All human women descended from the crash of the Eldridge (i.e., all inhabiting the planet the story takes place on) possess the genetic factor necessary to become the next incarnation of Miang – when the current one dies, Miang simply awakens in a new body. The target seems to be randomly selected, but she always inhabits the body of an adult female.”
Elly is the more complicated counterpart in that she is reborn entirely as a new person with the memory and significance of what she is and her role residing deep in the subtext of her memory, so can go entire lifetimes unaware of her role in the “grand scheme”, so to speak.
March 28th, 2007 at 6:37 pm
I´m pretty shure that Kara is the fifth Cylon how else could she get there with a Viper that has no jump capability (FTL).
And if so than, this means that the final five are born like humans.
Marginalise the difference between human and Cylons even further.
The Cylons hat Tigh in detention and did not figure out that he is Cylon with leads me to believe that the Final Five are not like the other Cylons.
March 28th, 2007 at 8:56 pm
Well I’m going to have to dissent from the consensus here that 3.19 was a great episode… I was pretty disappointed with both the script and the quality of the acting (particularly Bamber).
First, they tried to pack too much into the episode. Was RDM hoping/planning to get a mid-season extension to film more than just 19 episodes in Season 3. It seems to me like the last two episodes packed the story arc of 5 or 6 episodes. As such, I found the pacing of the post-Starbuck death episodes to be very unbalanced at various points. Granted, it’s a fine line between developing plot/character and keeping the story moving… but it seems to me that they didn’t develop the plots as fully as I wanted (and suspect that RDM wanted to as well).
Second, why spend so much precise time in the preceding two episodes developing Romo Lampkin’s character only to essentially shelve him for the climatic moments of Baltar’s trial? I didn’t find Bamber’s performance when testifying at Baltar’s trial at all convincing. Partly because he’s just a terrible actor (IMHO), but also the basic logic of his argument struck me as rather specious. “We’re all to blame, therefore none of us our to blame” was basically Lee’s plea to spare Baltar. But even if one accepts that argument, I don’t see how a reasonable person could acquit Balar as that doesn’t address Gaeta’s testimony (albeit untruthful) regarding Baltar’s complicity in the execution order.
Third, I also found the whole “Lee strips off the lawyer suit and jump into Viper 3!” at the end to be rather contrived and unrealistic. Ultimately, the show needs to remain credible in order to be enjoyable. And essential to building credibility is that characters suffer consequences for their actions. In “The Son Also Rises” it was a genuinely powerful moment when Lee stood up to Adama and resigned (mostly due to the fantastic acting of EJO). Like another powerful moment of rebellion from Apollo (pointing his gun at Tigh’s head), it was cheapened by the subsequent absence of consequences for Lee. Obviously one must suspend some amount of one’s realism to enjoy television (and sci-fi in particular), but I’m just not buying Lee’s repeated insubordination without suffering any consequences. Bamber is effective only when he is playing off of one of the show’s better actors (usually McDonnell or Olmos). The guy should simply never be allowed to give a monologue, AFAIC.
Fourth, two of the major plot twists were entirely predictable. In the first instance, Adama being among the three who voted to acquit Baltar was plainly obvious from the moment the verdict was read. In the second instance, it was clear that Apollo was going to encounter Starbuck the moment he broke formation to follow a bogey that only he was seeing.
Speaking of which, I’m agnostic on Starbuck’s return. On the one hand, I’m glad that she is definitely coming back. On the other, like most, I didn’t believe for a second that she was actually going to be killed off. Which brings up the point that I made earlier: the characters must suffer consequences for their actions in order for major dramatic moments to be credible. Every BSG fan (including myself) that I know was certain that Starbuck actually wasn’t going to be permanently dead, so “her death” at the end of Maelstrom was rather pedestrian. It was only a matter of how she would return, not whether she would. I’m reserving judgment on the plot twist until we learn more about what exactly happened to her and in what form has she returned in (Cylon, Head Kara inside Lee?).
RDM has a penchant for throwing a lot of major plot twists in his season finales in addition to the customary cliff-hanger, but I think that he overloaded Crossroads II with too many rapid-fire “what the hell” moments. While several were very predictable (Baltar’s acquittal, Starbuck’s return, Adama voting to acquit) I think that I would have enjoyed the episode more if the Anders/Tigh/Tory/Tyrol as Cylons had developed more gradually and completely. I found that whole story arc to be very unsatisfying–which annoys me since the anticipation/suspicion has been building for over a year.
Still an enjoyable hour of television, but I was really expecting something better. Hopefully the start to season 4 will address some of my plot concerns. And I am very bummed that it will be 9 months until the next BSG.
One final thought: for those looking for a Ronald Moore fix this summer, check out “Carnivale.” It was a series that Moore did for HBO a few years ago, in between DS9 and BSG, that you can find via Netflix (probably not popular enough to be carried by a majority of video rental stores). Without giving too much away, the series deals with very similar themes. In some ways, I’ve thought that BSG is a re-imagination of Carnivale as much as it a re-imagination of BSG 1978. Be forewarned: because the show was abruptly canceled, there were a lot of unresolved plot at the end (worse than Twin Peaks, IMHO).
March 29th, 2007 at 9:00 am
Are you guys going to do a real BSGcast for the season finale? I keep checking back to see if you’ve done it or not.
March 29th, 2007 at 10:06 am
I was wondering the same thing as MotherFraker.. Are you still so shocked that you can’t put the season finale under words or do we just have to be more patient? Look forward to seeing more of your shows!
March 29th, 2007 at 10:48 am
Does it confuse anyone else that the judging body in Baltar’s trial was called a “tribunal” even though there were 5 members? Doesn’t “tri” mean 3– as in there should have been 3 judges? That’s been bugging the crap out of me since they picked the names and it became clear that there would be 5 instead of 3. Couldn’t the writers have come up with another word for it?
March 29th, 2007 at 11:13 am
12 cylcons: 7 known, 4 (5) revealed
12 a very significant number. 12 sun signs, 12 colonies.
Religion: humans = greek mythology, cylons = judasim/christianity
BUT……!!!
Actually 13 colonies. 13th on earth
there are actually “13″ signs of the zodiac
…There are actually “13″ cylons. and BALTAR is one of them.
Baltar’s whole trial was very reminiscent of the judgment of Christ. Lee Adama basically says that we want one man to pay for our sins.
Baltar was last shown draped in a red cloth very iconic as Christ.
If Baltar is THE Cylon, it would only make sense that he has “12″ Disciples. ~ Ophiuchus
March 29th, 2007 at 3:18 pm
I’m pretty sure that they snuck in the 12th Cylon somewhere. I think it is either Ellen or Starbuck.
Ellen because Tigh said “Ellen…but where’s Ellen?” (Could be that he was just expecting her to be one or something)
And Starbuck because…well she returned when everyone thought she was dead. Also, the Fab Four is going to remain loyal to the fleet. Obviously the 5th one will as well, since the Final Five are completely different from the Original 7.
And I think that all 5 Cylons were revealed because of that seen with Caprica Six before, when she was dreaming of the Opera house. Gaius, Hera, and Six were walking up to the stage in shock as they saw that the Final Five weren’t there. Then they turned around and looked up in fear as the Final Five staired down at them. Why would all 5 of them have left the stage if only 4 were going to learn that they were Cylons?
And seriously guys, come out wth the BSGCast soon :p I am checking like every 2 hours to see if there is one yet, and I just keep seeing the freeze frame of a Mad Nat Woman.
March 29th, 2007 at 6:07 pm
Ryan- He said, “Ellen… What about Ellen?” I think this was him questioning himself (much like how he was questioning how he could be a Cylon when he fought in two Cylon wars).
I, like Ryan, am wondering when there’ll be the actual episode podcast.
Nine months… That gives me plenty of time to get my machinima comic book fan fiction series in full running.
March 29th, 2007 at 6:17 pm
Thanks CB, when I typed out that quote I was 90% sure it was wrong, but I couldn’t remember exactly what and didn’t feel like going to check again haha.
March 29th, 2007 at 6:50 pm
Ryan- No problem.
March 29th, 2007 at 8:04 pm
Here’s my question, If Roslin, Athena, Caprica, and Hera were all in the Opera house at the same time… was Baltar there too? And what does it mean for this group to be sharing a hallucination? Will ATT&T reveal themselves as cylons before the Opera gang actually see the faces? I’d like to see one of the Opera peeps figure it out before the ATT&T say something.
Side note: I live in vancouver, where BSG is filmed, and the Opera House is actually The Orpheum Theatre and it always makes me laugh when they treat it like some Alien place… mostly ’cause I saw the Goo Goo Dolls there last year… quite a different Vibe…
March 29th, 2007 at 9:09 pm
So,
Bob Dylan is a Cylon.
He realized this and went electric.
Or song is from their childhood with Ty being the oldest. Take release date of song (1967), add Ty’s age (40 yrs service plus 18yr old enlistment = 58) and you get when BSG is occurring. Therefore, they will arrive at earth about …… 2025
Thats right, 18 more years and you can see the 4th season openner up close and personal.
March 29th, 2007 at 10:46 pm
this is my theory
the final five are not the final five they are the first five [tigh having been serving in the military for how many years]. the reason that the other cylons do not know about them is because after the first war they were excomunicated and then they went to find earth.
in this episode we only saw 4 people meet so the fifth must have been starbuck and that would explain how she would be able to lead the way to earth.
two of the final [first] five are in position with great access to the leaders of the fleet so they could try to kill them like boomer tried to kill adama.
or are these cylons trying to unite the remainders of the twelve colonies with earth and the excuminicated cylons.
March 30th, 2007 at 1:23 am
Elle…. That is a good question about whether Baltar was there with them at the opera house but I am more inclined to believe that it was Capricas “Head Baltar” and not the man himself. Baltar has been there before though in his head though so it might have been…. hmmmm.
March 30th, 2007 at 4:59 am
Mafu- I don’t believe it is. Head Baltar is cleanshaven. The Baltar in the Operahouse hallucination had a full-on beard like he did in the real world. If it had been Head Baltar, then he would have been cleanshaved and in a different outfit. Because in the previous time we’ve seen Baltar and Head Six in the Operahouse, she was still the same as she usually is, except wearing a white dress (like we see in the sequence for “Crossroads, Part 2″).
But then again, I could be wrong.
March 30th, 2007 at 5:53 am
Up until now I was hoping that these four weren’t part of the “Final Five” but instead were guardians or servants to them. Unfortunately, after reading that interview, I’m a little depressed.
I mean really. These four characters are pretty droll, for characters that have been inflated so much in the last few months. They were supposed to be /the/ Final Five! Superheroes with sparkles and lasers or something, right? And we get… Tigh, Tyrol, Tory and Anders?!
They’re hardly even secondary characters. They’re support for the secondary characters! They’re the dirty, behind-the-scenes underdogs!
Give me Kara, Baltar, Roslin, Ellen… the ones we expected all along.
Although I guess RDM is just working his magic. Perhaps he is just being fair to four amazing actors that have given the show so much substance over the years. They need their time to shine, and I guess they’re going to get it, even if the logic behind how they could possibly be cylons is a little… skewed.
Or perhaps RDM has a point; these four are fundamentally different. They’re the support for the humans that has carried them through so much for so long. They’re supposed to be the underdogs; the only four people in the fleet that Adama and Roslin wouldn’t immediately airlock when they’re found out.
Maybe I would have been more amazed had they not started with these four hearing the music so early on. If it had been more of a shock, maybe I would have thought they were as amazing as Sharon… but I guess they’ve got a full season to change my mind!
March 30th, 2007 at 9:17 am
I see people arguing that Anders is the least likely of the Fab Four to actually be a Cylon since he’s not in a position of power, or close to important people who need watching or guarding. Tigh is second-in-command to Admiral Adama, Tori is chief of staff to President Roslin, and Tyrol is the deck chief who keeps the ship and the birds in repair. Sure, Anders was married to Starbuck, but most of that time they were separated (at least, after New Caprica).
But think about the time BEFORE they were married, when Anders was still on Caprica. In “Scar”, we learn that Starbuck’s love for Anders is keeping her alive–almost literally, because she’s not being careless with her own life anymore and taking the crazy risks that she used to. If not for Anders, Starbuck might have gotten herself killed, or might have killed herself in depression. But she made a promise to him to come back to Caprica and rescue him, and that kept her going.
Heck, that’s probably why Anders stayed so loyal to her even when she was frakking around on him–to keep on eye on her. And it may even be why, despite his drunken bout on the deck, he bounced back so quick from her death and started frakking Tori. Deep in his Cylon subconscious, he knew he’d fulfilled his mission to keep Aurora alive until she met her destiny, and now he could move on.
All this to say that the apparently least important of the Four might have served a greater purpose than we thought.
March 30th, 2007 at 11:52 am
MotherFraker, here’s the etymology of tribunal from etymonline.com:
Tribunal:
1447, from O.Fr. tribunal (13c.), from L. tribunal “platform for the seat of magistrates, elevation, embankment,” from tribunus “official in ancient Rome, magistrate,” lit. “head of a tribe,” from tribus (see tribe). Hence, a court of justice or judicial assembly (1590).
So the tri parts actually comes from “tribe” and doesn’t refer to “tri”. What you are thinking is probably “triumverate” which is similar but refers to “three”.
Regarding Anders, don’t forget that Six and Sharon spared his life when he was involved in the cafe bombing on Caprica. Perhaps subconsciously they knew he was a Cylon. They needed to spare his life because he would later serve a more prominent role (one we haven’t seen yet, unless frakin Tory is his first best destiny.)
March 30th, 2007 at 12:18 pm
How the hell could you say that Tigh & Tyrol are support for secondary characters? Are you frakkin’ mad? If you have been paying attention to ANY of this frakking show you would know that they are actually secondary characters.
March 30th, 2007 at 12:38 pm
Re: Anders
I think he’s a really good Cylon. I think it explains a lot, like how he was able to survive on Caprica. Also, Why do they all have Ts in thier name (Samual T. Anders)? It’s kinda been bugging me… I’m not suprised that he is, I think it’s a really posative step for him as a character, and a way for us to define him apart from Starbuck. He’s been so dependant on her for his identity that it’s good to see him coming into his own (with the piloting and guerrella warfare).
Also, he kept trying to tell Starbuck that Leoben was right about her and her destiny and the intensity of thier love is similar to Helo/Athena and Baltar/Six and Cali/Chief… and might explain why Boomer/Chief couldn’t make it… they’re Cylon Cylon and we’ve already seen that they thought they needed love with humans. Therefore, he and Tori won’t last long.
March 30th, 2007 at 12:47 pm
>>They’re hardly even secondary characters. They’re support for the secondary characters! They’re the dirty, behind-the-scenes underdogs!
>>
What do you mean they’re support for secondary characters? Tigh is the support to Adama, Tori is the support to Roslin. Are Adama and Roslin secondary characters? And Tyrol just had a whole episode written around him a couple weeks ago. As for Sam, see my earlier post.
Most of the posts have come to the conclusion that it’s pretty smart for the Cylons to be in supporting roles, because that way they can keep on eye on things from the inside. And it’s easier to influence the person in power than to _be_ the person in power (just ask Hillary or Dick). Adm. Adama and Roslin are too obvious to be Cylons. The Fab Four are just right.
March 30th, 2007 at 3:02 pm
RDM has proven to be a lying slag. He said Pegasus would not be destroyed because it was cliche. Lo and behold it went boom boom. So I don’t believe anything he says.
March 31st, 2007 at 2:55 am
Is Hera bringing them to the Opera House? Balter, Rosalin (through blood), 6, Athena, all are strong characters in her life. If we go with Matt’s circular theory, then maybe the first hybrid represents to the “good” cylons than they are ready to return home to Earth and live peacefully, Cylons and Humans together. This would go a little way to explaining why 6 knew that she just had to protect Hera’s life with her own. Tyrol’s kid wouldn’t be the same because Tyrol is a “fundamentally different Cylon”.
Does Hera want to show them something? Can she see all 12, or is she one of them? About the 6 drapes on the stage, is that because 6 is there and that makes up 7 or because Hera counts as one?
But then.. it was been stated “there are 12 cylon models”, right? So then Hera can’t be one. Also, it’s a little weird then that Helo doesn’t show up in the Opera House too, considering how he protects Hera.
Ahh.. it was worth a try!
Please come out with full-length BSGCast soon! Thank you.
March 31st, 2007 at 4:16 am
He actually said it would be cliche if it were destroyed in the same episode or story arc it were introduced in. Please get your facts right before insulting people.
March 31st, 2007 at 12:05 pm
I just re-watched The Son Also Rises, and was struck with an interesting idea about Romo Lampkin. In his letter to Baltar, he said that there is no more determined and dangerous an enemy (paraphrasing) than a son who decides to step from his father’s shadow. He also told Lee that he hated Joseph Adama, and that he taught him everything he knew. Could it be that he is the illigitimate son of Joseph Adama, and that he went into law because he knew who his father was (and was maybe even helped along by the father who couldn’t publicly acknowledge him)? Maybe we’ll see him again later, continuing to make life difficult for the brother he has envied. Well, maybe not (too soap opera-ish).
March 31st, 2007 at 2:57 pm
I’ll take a moment for clarification, since I’ve seemed to upset quite a few people!!
I know that Tigh and Tyrol aren’t support for secondary characters, but instead full blown secondary characters (and sometimes, even primary characters, each with their own episodes that fully surround them). However, they’ve often times faded so much into the background that you almost forget about them, for stretches of episodes at a time.
Therefore, it’s perhaps genius that they’re cylons; you’d almost never expect it. The only reason I would is that Tigh made it out of the detention center on New Caprica, and they’ve foreshadowed Tyrol a number of times.
Tory and Anders, on the other hand… Tory was a good Billy replacement, and Anders just helped make the Starbuck-Apollo relationship interesting and conflict-filled. Making Anders a cylon is almost like making Dee a cylon… /almost/. He does have a more interesting backstory than Dee, and he is the protector-type for Starbuck, leading her safely to her destiny.
I guess we’ll just have to wait and see how RDM explains all of this next season! I hope that they answer a good many of the questions; the hows and whys, and not leave so much of it up to our imaginations. They have a lot of spots to fill in!!
March 31st, 2007 at 5:34 pm
Gah, the new video doesn’t work.
March 31st, 2007 at 8:56 pm
Hey, Matt and Kat, I think I’ve got a theory about the final five. I’m not sure if anyone else has already posted this, but I think it would answer some questions brought up before.
What if the final five human Cylons (basically, Tigh, Tyrol, Tori, Anders and the final one that hasn’t been revealed yet) are prototypes of the human Cylon variety? I know a lot of people would not include the “Battlestar Galactica” comics from Dynamite Entertainment, but after flipping through them, they do present possible answers to how the Cylons went about going from the metal to the flesh kind. However, a lot of fans exclude the comics because they are not really canon and have some major continuity flaws. But what is presented in those comics do gets fans thinking.
Thus far, for the series, we have never gotten an answer as to the when and how the Cylons went from the full metal to human variety. But I do tend to think that they went through a lot of trials and errors just to be able to figure out how to create the human variety, the download process and everything else in between. Maybe the final five are prototypes of the human variety. Tigh would be, technically, the first prototype (which would make sense because he would have been intergrated into human society during the first Cylon war). Thinking from the point of view of a machine, it would make sense to have him be the very first. The first would be just to see if a human variety could be created and full work. The others (thus far, all being roughly around the same age) may have been further experimentation on variety body types (think about it, thus far, we have Anders {an athelete}, Tyrol {somewhat heavyset, but still rather musclar} and Tori {the only female amongst them and skintone being different from the others}).
“So, what if they are prototypes? How does that answer some of our questions?” A simple answer can be provided from another Glen A. Larson-created show: “Knight Rider”. Look at the episode “Trust Doesn’t Rust”, which marks the first appearance of KARR, KITT’s prototype. There was only one of KARR made, mainly due to the fact that something went wrong with him. KITT was created after that to improve on mistakes made with KARR (KARR even goes as far as to refer to KITT as a “production line model”). Therefore KARR is one prototype and KITT was one improved production line model. Now, if you look at real prototypes in general, normally one is made. And if that prototype works, then a “production line model” can come forth. If it doesn’t, then another prototype is made with knowledge from the previous failure, which in turn gets an improvement or try heading in a different direction. Tigh is the first prototype human Cylon that worked. Tyrol, Tori and Anders were all improved prototypes (all taken in a different direction). So, if the final five are prototypes, it would answer as to why the other human Cylons have never seen them before on any of their Basestars: Because there was only one copy made of them each. Which means, they do not have any spare bodies for them should they be killed (which means, that makes them even more close to being human, because there’s only one of each).
Of course, I could be wrong. This is just a simple possibility.
April 1st, 2007 at 12:04 am
Mmm… Anders… thank the gods he’s a frakkin’ cylon… so hott…
Lords of Cobol! Look at all the comments!!! Loved listening to you guys chat about the final episode…
I’m SO in the Cult of Baltar…
Pegasis coming back?! I think that’s cool… those three episodes were some of the absolute BEST episodes EVER!
HEHEHEHE… this is not goodbye… goodbye! Hilarious.
April 1st, 2007 at 3:20 pm
I think Starbuck has “ascended” like on Stargate and is now one with the Lords of Kobol
THe Final Five are tying into how the “religions of the Cylons and Colonials are linked”
Meanwhile….HOW CAN YOU NOT BE EXCITED ABOUT THE UPCOMING PEGASUS FLASHBACK MOVIE?!?!!?
The Cain Trilogy made the best hours of TV that BSG has EVER produced. They were the high-water mark of the series. Well, LDYB II was good as well, but everything that followed “Pegasus” was held up to it. I think it’ll get the show “back on track” as it were….
I think the final Cylon is Dualla, as they have dropped many clues about it….
Pleased to meet you/
hope you guessed my name/
but what’s puzzling you/
is the nature of my game
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-vkSO6mS9E
April 1st, 2007 at 5:22 pm
You guys rock so hard. why did it take so long? anyway, this was a great epi. and i am totally jonesing for some more bsg and bsgcasts. the 2 hour movie this fall will come just in time before I start getting the itch for more BSG
April 1st, 2007 at 5:52 pm
Great final cast – I’ll be keeping an eye on yourgeeknews too.
You’re right it is puzzling how the final 4/5 managed to survive the war. Could it be that the final 1/5 didn’t survive the war and that’s why they aren’t with the fleet?
April 2nd, 2007 at 12:25 am
Great Final Cast guys, really appreciate what you do! I’m going to write this theory in stone, I’d like to know what you think about it. Lee or Baltar is the Final Cylon, Baltar is Jesus Christ (metaphorically), The Original 7 and the Final 5 are in the midst of a civil war with the Final 5 taking up humanity’s fight for survival. The attack on the Colonies was the act that forced the Final 5 to act. As the Original 7 began to “seed” themselves throughout the Fleet, the Final 5 took up their posts to be the ‘Rock” to aid in humanity’s darkest hour. Think of it in “Terminator” terms, for every period in which the machines sent a Terminator, humanity sent something to oppose it. If we are to accept the 4 who were revealed as 4/5 of the Final 5, it makes sense due to their positions in the fleet. The whole Cult of Baltar, Baltar with that hood, it just seems that he could be the Cylon God or Jesus christ or something like that. I’m not so convinced in Lee being the Final Cylon, but if we are to believe Leoben with the Starbuck arc, then we must believe him with the “Adama is a Cylon” arc. Please set me straight here. Good Luck.
April 2nd, 2007 at 12:29 am
One more thing to mull over….How great would it be if Admiral Adama was the Final Cylon! If the leader of Humanity and it’s ultimate bedrock through the whole exodus was a Cylon. It would make sense that Lee is seeing a head-Kara since Lee would be a hybrid. It would also make sense with my previous statement of the Final 5 taking up positions to save humanity. Now that would be a trip. Thanks ALL
April 2nd, 2007 at 12:36 am
I think the last of the 5 will be someone noone is expecting. Starbuck isnt it. At one time I thought that maybe she was, but what if it is someone we see all the time, or what if it is someone we will see for the first time later on. Perhaps the final one is already on Earth and its President Bush? (kidding) This last episode revealed so much and left us with even more “What Ifs”.
April 2nd, 2007 at 12:37 am
Oh and Nat, I am in love with you.
April 2nd, 2007 at 12:39 am
Take a number there Scanner!
April 2nd, 2007 at 12:43 am
wait wait. 12 tribes. 12 cylons. The 13th Tribes could have been cylons. What has has come before blah blah. Damn its all fading now. I had the answer to life, the universe and BSG and its gone. NOOOOO!!!! Seriously though, what the hell does the numbers have to do with it all. Numbers always come up in patterns in my life and I pay attention to them, so this is driving me bonkers!
April 2nd, 2007 at 1:34 am
Nooooo! I can’t download the full BSGCast….WHYYYYYYYY? *cries*
Is anyone else having this problem, it better not have been an april fools joke, that would’ve been mean
.
What an awesome episode it was, I need some closure!
April 2nd, 2007 at 9:53 am
Scanner Says:
“wait wait. 12 tribes. 12 cylons. The 13th Tribes could have been cylons. What has has come before blah blah. Damn its all fading now. I had the answer to life, the universe and BSG and its gone. NOOOOO!!!! Seriously though, what the hell does the numbers have to do with it all. Numbers always come up in patterns in my life and I pay attention to them, so this is driving me bonkers!”
The answer is 42! 12 cylon models from the colonial wars, and 30 more populating earth as part of the 13th Tribe. There’s your answer… now what was the question?!?
April 2nd, 2007 at 10:07 am
JStrnad said:
>>I’ll take a moment for clarification, since I’ve seemed to upset quite a few people!!>>
I promised myself I wouldn’t gunk up Matt & Nat’s message boards by starting an argument, and it looks like I almost did. Sorry, JStrnad, and thank you for responding with thoughtfulness. You’re a good sport.
I know it’s hard to believe RDM after the fast one he tried to pull on us (successfully/unsuccessfully?) about Starbuck being dead, but I really do believe him when he says these four are Cylons, and that they are fundamentally different. I’m excited to find out what that means, how they came to be, etc. It’s gonna be a good ride. Too bad the line to get on the ride is eight months long.
April 3rd, 2007 at 12:04 am
Ok I know Matt put this theory through before, however, I just can’t put it down. There are too many 12s running around for it to be a coincidence. 12 colonies, 12 Battlestars, 12 Cylon Models, 12 Lords of Kobol, it all just can’t be coincidence. Here’s one more, there were 4 Basestars of the Cylon fleet pictured in the nebula before we saw Earth, 4 basestars, 4 revealed Cylons. There is sooooo much smoke here with all these numbers and I just can’t find the fire, I can’t put it all together. In the scene with Caprica, Baltar, and Hera in the Opera House….there were only SIX lit banners on the wall, but all FIVE final Cylons were there with their lit cloaks. There are too many numbers running around, and there is no way any of it is coincidence. The clue to unlocking the secrets are in these numbers. Good Luck All.
April 3rd, 2007 at 5:06 am
Kind of related but i just wanted to point out this music video posted on youtube last year in november. After the episode i thought (man i’ve heard that song before on a bsg music vid) and sure enough i found this old vid 1) note the song, 2) note the first four recognisable characters in the video. I recommend the creator of this vid as the next fan of the week haha
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7da3iwxMUjU
=]
and about the episode, i’m very impressed with this show, few shows have impressed me lately so i’m happy. Even if it’s more adhoc and less thought out than some other stories (ie babylon 5) it is still well written and enjoyable. I hope the show goes out with a bang in the fourth season and doesn’t drag on like other sci fi franchises(star trek anyone?).
April 3rd, 2007 at 7:50 am
Whoa… holy crap, Bill! THat’s nuts…. I can’t believe that vid has been up since November. Seriously prophetic!
~Matt
April 3rd, 2007 at 4:32 pm
I think the fifth should be someone like Kat or Crashdown or Racetrack or Ellen… What if it was Carol-Ann, the admirl’s wife? ’cause that would still make Lee a hybrid…
April 5th, 2007 at 9:37 am
[...] Zitat von billthecanuck … 1) note the song 2) note the first four recognisable characters in the video. … Quelle: BSGcast 3.19 – Crossroads Part 2″ The Real One! | Battlestar Galactica [...]
April 5th, 2007 at 5:23 pm
Hey, do you have the audio portion of All Along the Watchtower that was used in the show that you could upload somewhere??
Putting it as a ringtone sounded like an awesome idea
April 6th, 2007 at 12:54 pm
Did anyone noticed that when the fleet jumped into the nebula, it was the same sound that it usually makes??? Does that mean something?
April 7th, 2007 at 4:13 pm
Hey Corey,
We’ve managed to pull an audio clip from the end of the episode, but as far as a proper music file, no… not yet. August is when the soundtrack comes out, so we’ll be all over that!
~Matt
April 8th, 2007 at 12:27 pm
When I found out Tryol was a Cylon, my first thought was… NICKY IS A HYRBRID. What will that mean for season 4?????
April 8th, 2007 at 12:53 pm
Matt and Nat:
Good video season. I hope to see more next! Come and vist…
– Shane, Bsgwiki EN
April 11th, 2007 at 12:25 am
M+N: will you be going back and doing podcast reviews of Season 3.0?
Pleased to meet you/
hope you guessed my name/
but what’s puzzling you/
is the nature of my game
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-vkSO6mS9E
April 11th, 2007 at 1:37 am
9 months!!!!!!
Great episode guys.
April 11th, 2007 at 5:12 am
how did Baltar not know that Tigh was a cylon? If he was screening people waaaay back in season 1 (tigh me up, tigh me down), and he was doing all the important people, how did he not get to tigh? He knew whar ellen’s results were, and boomers too… logically, he’d keep track of everyone’s himself (due to his self-preservation instinct). Logically, they’d test all the important people, Adama Roslin, probably all the ships captains, key ministers and the quorum… even at that they made it clear that Galactica personal were the priorty. Say there were 100 people to test before tigh (100*11=1100/24= 45.833 days) There are over 200 days in which he could actively test people, given he could do 2 a day, it’s still 400 people before the election gets crazed (and allowing for off and busy days) How could he test 400 people and not have gotten to tigh or Tyrrol?
April 14th, 2007 at 8:19 am
Hi folks,
I’m just going to go a weeee bit off-topic here, but: does anyone here have the Soundtrack to Season 2? If not, THEN GO OUT AN GET IT!!! Un-fraking-believable. Absolutely beautifully well done. You WILL love it if you like big heavy scores.
Regards
April 14th, 2007 at 9:30 am
Drydock,
I really get the impression that the final 5 cylons are VERY human… possibly even born into the Colonies by natural parents, but the genetic code of the Colonials have these four or five people who in every few generations are genetically cloned by random combinations of pre-rodained DNA. I think all the Colonials are Cylons, and they are programmed to reproduce a Tigh, a Tori, a Tyrol and an Anders in every 75 years or so. Otherwise, there’s no way RDM can explain how Tigh fought in the first Cylon war before the other 7 cylon humanoids existed…
Just a mad theory!
~Matt
PS. Agreed, Ripley, the Soundtrack to Season 2 is awesome! Can’t wait till august to get my hands on Season 3!
April 15th, 2007 at 5:11 am
Hey guys, just wanted to say thanks for making the amazing podcasts, and to put up a theory, or more accuratly a train of thought.
Okay so from previous episodes its been revealed that Cylon skinjobs are more resistant to radioactivity which explains why they could occupy a post apocalyptic Caprica (like humans with background radiation). This would explain why Baltar would need plutonium (or more specifically its radioactivity) for his Cylon detector back in season 1. This led me to wonder about the final 4/5. If they did have the same resistance to radioactivity then it could be that this is how they managed to survive the nuclear attack on the colonies. With an atomic blast most of the harm to humans is from radiation rather than the explosion itself, if the final five had the resistance to radiation then they might be able to last longer through the radiation than the regular humans, so might have made it to escaping ships in time to survive (putting aside any ‘guided by the Gods’ type thing). However, one would have to assume that they would not have this resistivity because of the cylon detector, Tigh would probably have been tested because of his high status in the fleet.
It made me wonder though, if the final 4/5 dont have this radiation resistance then what physically makes them Cylons? So far the only things Ive been able to deduce to differentiate skinjobs from humans is their ability to ressurect, the radiation resistance and the partial infertility that they have. However it seems as though these final 4/5 have different differences (wonder how many times I can use Difference in a different form
) in that they can hear the transmission in the ionian nebula and are somehow ‘guided to things’ (the gym, the temple). What if they were simply guided through their lives to take points on the battlestar or on the fleet that survived. It hardly makes sense, but I think it kind of fits with BSGs somewhat prophetic themes (like the angels or Starbuck’s purpose with the paintings).
Another thing I was thinking about is the whole process of cylon resurrection. Presumably in order to survive death the Cylons need to send out a transmission of some kind to a ressurection ship in the vicinity for the ship to even know that they are dead. I would imagine then that this signal is then recieved and new memories are implanted into ‘cloned’ bodies of the Cylon that has died. Wouldnt it stand to reason then that perhaps instead of sending out signals, the final five were instead able to receive signals? It would explain why Chief was able to find the temple, and why they were able to hear the song at the end. It might also explain why they were able to ascend to high roles in the fleet, if they were able to have a heightened perception of those around them wouldnt that make them better leaders? Bit of a long shot but Im just thinking.
Anyway enough ramble for now, love what you guys are doing on the cast :0
May 29th, 2007 at 7:30 am
I have read many theories and personally, I haven’t the foggiest about what the frak is goin on! Too many theories. I do like the idea of Starbuck being Colonel Tigh, the man with one eye’s hybrid daughter tho. Drinking issues, temper tantrums, major head frak ups, they haven’t always got on (to say the least).
If zak Adama turns up I will be very annoyed however!
Don’t know whether i’ve missed this one somewhere along the lines but think right back, back to the start….who left the note for Adama explaining that there are 12 cylon models? Does that hold a clue to who the final cylon is? Or was it just a way of making us, the audience go ‘ooooo!’ ?
Any thoughts or am i just being mega conspiracy theoretical in my long, torturous wait for season 4?
Cheers
June 3rd, 2007 at 6:52 pm
Okay, I have just found this site, and let me that it is great! I’ve already shown some BSG fans I work with, so hopefully they will be logging on soon.
As to the final five cyclons and theories about who is what, and what does it mean to be a member of the final five, let me throw my little idea into the hat. First off, I think Starbuck is a cyclon. Yes, yes, I know, boo and hiss me now. But here is why she is important. I think that the Final Five, with Kara as their leader were the Cyclons that put an end to the last Cyclon war, and the ones that drove them all into hiding. I also think that the Cyclon fleet that jumped into the nebula are only manned by the Final Five models, which is why the 4 on Galactica came together. The song, was a trigger used to spark their programing so that they could help humanity. Kara still can have a destiny, as the Cyclon that a. helps humanity get to Earth, where the Final Five and Humans co exist, and also, put an end to the War by leading her people ( aka the final five) and the BSG to victory. At least, that’s my to cents. Please, insert flames here.
June 6th, 2007 at 12:49 pm
Awesome, Sorshadeanin! Glad to hear you enjoy the site and the BSGcast, and hopefully your friends do too
We’re pretty excited about Season 4, and about “Razor” the Pegasus movie coming up in the Fall! We’ll be sure to get as much fun content as possible for that!!
~Matt + Nat
August 11th, 2007 at 1:16 am
OK, I’ll comment on a few things the others have said:
1) Starbuck knows who her dad was. In “Home”, we learned he was a pianist. That doesn’t sound like Tigh.
Of course, you could always make up some story that she didn’t know who her real dad was, etc.
2) Why wouldn’t Chief Tyrol be able to conceive a child? All we know is that the Cylons have been unsuccessful in reproducing WITH EACH OTHER. That makes sense if Cally is human. So far we only know of one Cylon female who was able to conceive with a human male (Sharon/Helo), and now we know of one Cylon male able to conceive with a human female (Chief/Cally).
3) Baltar in Caprica Six’s dream, and in Roslin’s dream, did not have a beard. But that doesn’t mean he is not Baltar. Six had a white dress in each of these dreams, including Caprica’s dream – the same white dress that Head Six had in Baltar’s vision in “Kobol’s Last Gleaming”. It makes sense that
4) I don’t believe that Baltar is a Cylon. That would ruin his story, it would be an easy way out for him (he basically wished to be a Cylon so he could get rid of the guilt and feel as a ‘hero’), and his story and his relationship with 6 is great BECAUSE HE IS HUMAN. I think that Baltar is in a way the most “human” character – represeting so many of the typically human flaws and weaknesses, he exemplifies the very un-Cylon individualism, ego and self-centredness (Cylon society is supposed to be based on uniformity and individuals are less important than the collective; that’s why Three model was boxed, they were becoming too individualistic and were starting to rebel), as well as a brilliance and unpredictability. I would hate to see that spoiled. I agree that he is also the “father” figure for Hera, as Six is the “mother” figure, and why would 2 Cylons be spiritual parents to a hybrid baby?
It will be so interesting to see more Caprica/Roslin and Caprica/Roslin/Athena interaction in the 4th season.
4) Everyone seems to be forgetting that Anders is not just Starbuck’s love interest, he was also the leader of the Resistance on Caprica and one of the leaders of the Resistance on New Caprica.
5) “Good” and “evil” Cylons? Oh, please, can’t we put those black-and-white classifications to rest? There are no clear ‘good’ and ‘bad’ guys in BSG> Are there still people who believe the Cylons (or at least the 7) are ‘evil’, adn the humans are ‘good’. And Colonel Tigh an example of a ‘good’ person, are you kidding me? And Tory, we don’t know much about her, but so far she’s arranged an election fraud and been complicit in stealing a baby away from her parents. And do you seriously classify No.8/Sharon as ‘evil’? The only Cylon characters so far that I would classify as evil in the strict sense were the Cavils and a few of the Dorals we’ve seen. When you look at the humans, most of them can’t be strictly classified as good either.
6) Whoever said two Cylons can’t have real love or something like that…Chief and Boomer really loved each other. But she was killed and he had to get over her, and to deal with the fact he loved a Cylon. The Chief/Cally relationship has been without any such obstacles. Which might change now. I’d love to know what happens if she finds out! And I agree with Nat…Cally annoys the hell out of me!
Anyway… from what we’ve seen, the Significant 7 need humans to be able to fall in love. They don’t seem interested in sexual/romantic relationships with each other. My theory is that it’s because they’re so used to the other models, that it would be like incest. So, for instance, if you’re a Leoben, when you see a Six or an Eight, you won’t be thinking ‘what a hot chick’, you’d be thinking of her as a sister. That would explain why the Cylons who think of themselves as human / haven’t been a part of the Cylon society are sexually attracted to each other – Chief/Boomer, Anders/Tory. (Similar phenomenon has been noted in regard to humans in real life: boys and girls who grew up as siblings in foster families or in a commune, such as kibutzes in Israel, see each other as siblings and don’t enter into relationhips with each other. Onthe other hand, blood relatives who haven’t grown up with each other don’t have the same attitude.)
August 22nd, 2007 at 10:13 am
I’ve just had a vision of who the 5th cylon is! And I think I know why they are doing a backstory on the Pegasus… The 5th Cylon is Admiral Cain!!! She’s not dead! she’s resurected, and will play an important roll in 2008!
September 14th, 2007 at 3:03 am
Hi, i have just learnt about Battlestar and i love the show it is great.
Love the reveal of the Final Four cylons, it was great. i dont think that the fifth was on galactica in the final episode otherwise the person would have heard the music and come to the room to. So for me that rules out Roslin, Adama, Lee, Helo, well really everyone that was onboard.
As for starbuck being part of the final five, i dont think that she is because RDM likes to do stuff that is not obvious to the general audience and having starbuck showing up in the final minute makes it seem like she could be. So i dont think that she will be. An example of this is that RDM has said that the died hard fans would have picked up on that when lee broke off to go and find the bogie it was starbuck but most ppl would not.
Also to the comments about why Baltar’s machine did not pick up on the people being cyclons. in the episode when ellen was first introduced baltar in one of his conversations with head six said that from now on all test will be coming back cylon negative i think the exact comment was from memory ‘ makes it so much easier’. So the test is a fake.
Cant wait till the show comes back. bring it on
November 5th, 2007 at 6:30 pm
Hi guys!
I love the bit about Tigh being Kara’s dad, my mom actually suggested that to me too! Another idea we had is that Ellen Tigh is the last cylon! Wouldn’t that be great? How could they not bring someone back from the dead as a cylon at least once in this show? It would be great if it was Billy, but I think that it’s gotta be a woman.
Thanks for all the footage of Katee!
August 3rd, 2010 at 11:44 am
Hi, do you know where I should r arr a rrr pirrrraaaatz