BSGcast 4.20 – “Islanded in a Stream of Stars”
The very last of our non-two-part-cliff-hangers for the season. Can’t you tell? Ah, it seems like every episode of this season has been one cliff-hanger after the next, but with Hera in Cylon hands and Anders acting all kinds of Hybrid, there’s lots to talk about in this momentum-building tee-up of an episode!
Check out Justin’s London England Frak-Party on Facebook!
March 6th, 2009 at 8:14 pm
You know, if the end of the final episode is Daniel Graystone taking off a VR device and commenting on the Battlestar Galactica program and how good it is, I will just frakking space myself . I just thought everyone should know.
March 6th, 2009 at 9:00 pm
You, know, I want to see more Baltar this episode. It seems that this last ten episodes have been seriously lacking in some Baltar action. It’s like he’s become a bit player, when we all know he’s a very important one. I hope these last three episodes have Baltar doing some exciting stuff and getting back into character.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:03 pm
Thoughts on this episode:
RIP Bitchin Six
Will Roslin die the quiet little death she said she would?
Kara you confuse the hell out of me.
Nice that we didn’t see Adama have that paint sex Kara and Leoben did.
Bros til the end…
March 6th, 2009 at 11:03 pm
Anders is a cybrid/Hybrid…whatever! Still frakking awesome. Two very touching moments for me. Kara and Lee at the memorial wall. That was so heartfelt. And Tigh with Adama at the very end. Very moving. The music was a nice touch.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:08 pm
Baltar’s a d***! Kara confides in him….well sorta and he blurts it out to everyone after a freaking funeral. What an ass. Man did Adama lose it. And how creepy was Anders as a Hybrid of Galactica? And they’re abandoning ship… in style. I’ll miss the “Bucket”! To Galactica!! *toast* The last 3 hours (2 weeks) are gong to be EPIC and INTENSE!!!!!!
March 6th, 2009 at 11:08 pm
Boomer never downloaded any parenting skills. I will admit that she really got under my skin talking to Hera as she did – wanting to knock her out and stuff her back into the box. I think every parent here at BSGCAST is in line to give her a few parenting lessons – painful lessons to be sure.
Was that a joint Roslin & Adama were sharing?
Baltar should have been thrown out an airlock for outing Starbuck. This is something I am more than a little sensitive to. I’m still ticked at my brother, and its been 2 years now.
Wow! Did you see Hera ramming showing the model basestar with the Galactica!? Now we know how the ship will meet her end. It looks like the Admiral is going on a one-way trip to get Hera and take out Cavil. Plus, it looks like Apollo & Starbuck were joining the mission. THAT is a fitting end for the Gray Lady! Sorry. The Grand Old Lady.
I love a tragic hero! And Galactica is that hero.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:12 pm
Looks like the Galactica is going down fightin’ baby! Did anyone get the vibe that Kara was going to kill herself? Cause after Baltars little sermon and seeing her get upset, and the fact that her and Lee had there little moment and then she put her picture on the memorial, I had a Dualla flashback moment.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:12 pm
Gorgeous episode!
Although we didn’t get many answers… I thought it opened up quite well for the very few episodes we have left.
Seeing Helo so… destroyed was heartbreaking. Penikett’s performance, though short, was outstanding. I felt awful for Helo and only wished Adama would grant him his wish…
As for Hera, I was glad to hear her say more. I was tempted to say she was mute. Her “I want my mommy” bits were pretty real, and I’ll give her much kudos. For a little girl her age, she sure knows how to act. When she calls out to Boomer at the end, it truly was hard to watch. “More will join you soon?” What did that mean? Speaking of which… Those colonies are quite creepy. They look everything but inviting. At least the Basestars look… esthetically good. But this… uh… Yeah. LOL
The beginning gave me immense chills. The way that six saved them and screamed for them to lock up the door… Ugh. I still have goosebumps. Beautifully executed.
As per Anders… Wow, that was creepy. The way he talks now is just scary. I was hoping him being connected to the Battlestar would actually accelerate its healing and save it… But I guess not. I’m also inclined to believe that the Galactica is indeed the dying leader.
I was also very glad to FINALLY see some interaction between Caprica Six and Baltar. It annoyed me that they didn’t so much as gave each other a second glance since the end of season 3. However, I felt that her line “You haven’t changed at all, Gauis. But I have.” explained everything. It actually satisfied me as an answer. Strange, isn’t it?
Baltar’s coup at divulging to everyone that Kara found her body on Earth made me want to slap him… And hey! Kara did! lol
March 6th, 2009 at 11:18 pm
Sorry to be a contrarian, folks, but this episode was horrible. Absolutely bloody horrible. So little happened in this episode that it could have been truncated to 10 mins. This would have given the writers another 35 mins of air time to actually sketch out a full plot with drama and character development.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:20 pm
So when is the hybrid going to get out of her tub? Is she “Danielle”?
The “Fortress of Doom” was a little too fake looking, it seemed to be a section of an Ouroboros or a ring world. Were my eyes failing me or did I see about 8 unknown ships in a circular formation when Boomer was parking the raptor, including “Retro-Raider”/”Disco-Raider”.
I have the feeling we are going to see centurions from all the different repeating cycles of the Human-Cylon War. And I back up that point with this little bit of trivial information. The roof of the room where Cavil was getting Hera seemed to be a little too high and accommodating for him to be the “great evil” of this story. If Boomer had peeked around the corner of that room she would have found herself with a “Council of Centurions” and they would have blown her brains out for knowing to much. (At this point Cavil seems like a puppet to me)
Why is it every time I see a Humanoid Cylon die I feel like someone just punched me in the stomach? Great Show Overall
BTW did you see that Mr. Olmos got paint on his teeth. I would love to see the gag reel on that!
March 6th, 2009 at 11:22 pm
Bradj84 – I certainly thought Hara was going to kill herself. She had the smile of someone who already considered herself dead. That’s why she is joining the Admiral’s mission with Galactica. This is a way to die with honor.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:24 pm
Did anyone else notice that when Tigh went to see the Eight in the infirmary before she died, she said “Theres too much confusion.” The look on his face was priceless. I was hoping that there would be a follow up to that offhand comment, but sadly, there wasn’t. There has to be some sort of significance to it. That one of Tighs ”children” as Ellen calls them, says a line from the song that switched on the Final Four.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:26 pm
And here we go! This was a great set up to the finale! The final scene with Tigh and Adama toasting the old girl… CLASSIC! Kind of made me feel the same as the next to last episode of DS9. You KNOW something big is coming down the pike and you just can’t wait.
The future of the human and Cylon races rests with Hera and the last Battlestar….. GALACTICA.
The darkest hour is just before the dawn and we have now passed through it. The time has finally come….
For DAYBREAK.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:28 pm
OMG Was Kara Peeing in the bathroom stall that Athena was locked in? It’s hilarious if the fact that the latch was broken was a throwback to Athena escaping the W.C.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:40 pm
Am I going mad or did I see an old fashion Cylon raider lifting off as Boomer flew her stolen raptor into colony thing?
March 6th, 2009 at 11:46 pm
I’ve been busy for the last couple weeks, but I’m back. In the back of my mind I was half ways expecting the episode to end with Cavil telling the imperious leader that their mission was a success. I’m so glad the back of my mind was half ways wrong.
March 7th, 2009 at 12:00 am
Looks like Anders is going to be the Hybrid to the Galactica for the final round with Cavil. Did it look to anyone else that the raiders we saw in the Colony were the original type? Did Cavil and the original Centurions join forces? (It would seem the Cylons aren’t the original Cylons from Ellen’s reference to them as her children).
Grace Park was great in this episode. The painful Athena scene with Helo. Boomer (surprisingly) was really going through a lot of emotions in this episode, a lot of pain. I liked seeing Boomer’s humanity (for lack of a better word) in this episode, her recollection of the Picon house, and finally connecting with little Hera.
As a side note, I’m curious if we’ll ever find out who the Eight standing by Ander’s side is.
March 7th, 2009 at 12:43 am
Hey All,
I thought tonight episode was good but that all of the sorry lines were secondary yet again. There was no a-story. What’s going on Ron D. Moore?
I really felt for Helo and Athena. Their scene was short but memorable. I wouldn’t know what to do with myself if I have been beaten up by my Boomer-equivalent and stuffed into a locker only to watch my Hubby have passionate sex with her. Then to top it all off my Boomer-equivalent kidnap my super important hybrid kid. Of course, Athena is pissed Helo! She is so pissed she can’t even talk about it. It doesn’t help with the cryptic day/projection dream that Roslin, Six, and Athena share are reappearing. What’s up with that anyway?However, trying to make Athena say she hates you will not help anyone least of all you. And, begging Adama will not help. You just need to deal with your own guilt without everyone else.
Oh, I have major respect for the Six that saved that whining crew member(s).
I really need Tigh to accept who he is. Yeah, I know he has major bro-love for Bill but come on. You’re a cylon. In fact, you are pretty important to the cylons and they are important to you whether you admit or not. Embrace your children, man! Also, what’s going on with Tigh and Six? Ever since little Liam fell back into the abyss, we haven’t seen them together or heard talk about have much love they have for each other.
Plus, the dying Eight was right. There is too much confusion. All of the characters are holding on to much and it is clouding what path they need to take. The only way any of them will survive will to truly unit…not just in saying but in action. In essence, they need to build that bond of shedding blood together brings since so much blood has been split. And more is to come. I would hope that if we came down to something of this scale that we could learn and grown from such events. Let’s try to find a solution without all of the pettiness and grudges. What’s done is done.
I would love to hate Boomer, but is like my Baltar-cylon-equivalent. So, you have to like her complexity. I think she may redeem herself by helping Hera…if she doesn’t punk out.
I thought the whole Adama crying/paint scene was a little much. When the galatica was built they took short cuts—so in essence that ship was a goner from the beginning. No amount of life-goop would fix that problem. They have been running, fighting, and making compromises for their lives for years now. It shouldn’t have taken this long for Adama to reach the same conclusion everyone else had two episodes ago and execute it. Plus, now we know that Galatica will go out in style by taking out a Colony.
Lee still irks me. Although, it was nice of him to take a moment and let Kara know that even though no one knows for sure what she is—he still digs her.
Sam will obviously be the hybrid for the galatica against Cavil.
Kara, oh Kara. I don’t blame Baltar for outing Kara to the fleet. She took that chance when she gave him those tags. So, I am of the frame of mind that Kara wanted the news to come out. In a way, it was her washing away all of the crap she had been dealing with to accept that she is something that is still in shadow. Acknowledging that allows her to focus on something more important—say that song that holds some mysterious answer. This is why that slap was half assed. Perhaps, that song is the new command Sam was talking about?
I am not sure what is going on with Baltar, but I am fairly certain that when all is said and done Baltar will have perfected his ‘religion’. It may be the only thing that will survive intact once this is all done.
LOL, Roslin and Adama getting high was priceless. Leave it to drugs to bring out the important heart to heart chats.
March 7th, 2009 at 12:47 am
It’s interesting how they discern the Cylon’s “One True God” to be Different from Baltar’s group “One True God”.
March 7th, 2009 at 12:57 am
It’s weird, bsg has taken a weird turn ever since the end of season 3… the lovable supporting characters have all been dying, it started with cally, and went on to Gaeta Zarek and Dualla…. I know that they did this so that there’s more room for the main plot in the end, but I can’t help but feel depressed.. galactica feels empty…
March 7th, 2009 at 1:07 am
I also think this this episode can be describe as the calm before the storm. I really liked the opening as it shows that the humanoid cylons and the humans are starting to treat one another like…well…like humans do when we have to interact with each other.
My personal feeling concerning Baltar is that he is like Kara, I think he did die in his house with Caprica Six as nothing and no one would have survived that kind of blast, the sheer power of the of the shock wave itself is enough to turn anything into dust.
So the colony is a space station after all and solves, well at least for me, where the hell the cylons went to after their war with the 12 colonies, and i really like the irony of it all that the cylons choose to name it The Colony and i think that the ship that the final five made their journey to the twelve colonies might be still there. The colony actually looked different in design then the basestars so i am wondering maybe cavil is taking too much credit then he deserves and he could be just another tool, as XanthosisX mentioned before, in the grand scheme and the true evil has yet to show his or their faces.
I think that this time the cycle will finally be broken but its rdm’s story and he will end it the way he intended to end it. the end will piss off a lot of people and it will satisfy a lot too but it all it was one hell of a ride and even if the cycle starts anew or end this show will be remembered for years and years to come and i for one have enjoyed a lot.
I am so anxious to see Glactica go out like a soldier with a big bang and not die from old age, and i would love to see her plow right into Cavil or Cavils i should say…lol… I got this picture in my head of Galactica’s reflection in Cavil’s eyes right before she blows him out of creation, wouldn’t that be a kodak moment huh?. But i have a feeling that Boomer has his name written on her and she would put a bullet between his eyes as some sort of poetic justice as he turned on his mentors so his pupil or “Pet Eight” as he like to call her would turn on him and shell suffer the same fate as he inflicted on the final five, Karma’s a bitch! eh!
now what can i say about Hera. Man that child is something, she carries the hopes of not just one nation but two, Talk about baggage. I love how she got under boomers skin and the way she cried for her mommy and later she cried for Boomer just made me tear up, and being a dad myself to three year old girl did not help that fact at all. Those scenes with Hear and Boomer just made want to go and grab my little girl out of bed and hug her. no child should be taken away like that from their loving parents.
I for one feel that there is no more much we can say or deduce as the end is nigh. and all that is left for us to do is just wait two more weeks and see how it all ends. But the one thing i do have to ask is, Where was the chief in this episode????
March 7th, 2009 at 1:41 am
I loved the beginning with Hera guiding the Galactica to the basestar. Nice foreshadowing RDM! And good metaphor. Hera’s the one guiding them to their end/destiny.
And yes everyone those were old school raiders. Weird huh? I guess we’ll find out what they’re doing their next week?
I liked seeing the return of the Opera House. My theory from last weeks post stills stands, if anyone wants to read it go look it up.
And yeah I’m wondering if someone is pulling Cavils strings as well. The old school raiders. The “more will join you” comment. Something smells fishy.
March 7th, 2009 at 2:18 am
@Kylon: I couldn’t agree with you more. This was indeed a HORRIBLE episode, and like the dreadful “Deadlock” ep, it is WAY TOO LATE IN THE GAME for filler crap! Some of the emotional interaction scenes were okay, but we’ve seen more than okay in other eps. I kept hoping for SOMETHING to blow me away, but instead the ep dragged and dragged. The whole time I was like, “Sheez, come on already people! Answer some frakkin questions!!!!”
And yeah, I get the feeling that Baltar and Kara have a lot in common. They BOTH should be dead, but for some HOPEFULLY SOON TO BE EXPLAINED REASON, we’ll find out exactly WHY they’re walking among the living.
I’m really, really, really hoping that “Day Break” parts One and Two will simply knock our ever lovin’ socks off. Sweetly. Poetically. Brilliantly. All that stuff. Otherwise, I’m going to seriously be pissed.
March 7th, 2009 at 2:20 am
One more thing, that’s clearly a different girl playing Hera. It was obvious to me in last week’s ep. Anybody know why they changed girls? I haven’t read everyone’s comments just yet. Just wondering….
March 7th, 2009 at 2:22 am
Quick thoughts…
Yep, as I recanted in the last episode, Starbuck is NOT a human (trust Baltar’s chemistry skills)
Ellen said Tigh had MILLIONS of children. I guess that means that the humans are out numbered thousands to one.
The old style raiders means old style centurions and the possibility of the Lucifer model.
Baltar is the same thing as Starbuck, he died on Caprica. You see Caprica Six was resurrected after the blast so Baltar at her feet was killed too.
Still awaiting the old BSG style colonials to show up and nuke the cylons, hybrids and cylon loving humans inorder to leave a pure race. Hera survives in the confusion because Baltar says she is his daughter. Hera becomes Pythia. All head characters are the same LOK. That LOK is killed by the others for heresy.
All ends badly. Until what has happenned before begins to happen again.
Have you ever felt you’ve been cheated.
March 7th, 2009 at 2:24 am
For above, Starbuck is also not a cylon.
March 7th, 2009 at 3:05 am
I like how in the previews for the next episode, when everyone is crammed in that hanger deck (when Adama makes a speech), you see Helo at the very front center with his arms crossed. He’s the first one for this one way trip.
MATT AND NAT – Could you guys tell us how many episodes are OFFICIALLY left?
Are there like 2 more 45 minute eps. left and thats it?
Whats this I hear a 3 hour movie on forums or is that a rumor?
Is that part of it or seperate.
I think at this point any extra footage of action, story, character development, etc. Could really be worth watching. Especially now that there is so much to show and answer.
March 7th, 2009 at 3:23 am
The cylon colony looks to me like something The Shadows from babylon 5 would come up with.
March 7th, 2009 at 3:42 am
@ thee_immortal_one: I have two questions and a comment for you.
1) Why are so bitter about this show?
2) If you are so bitter and disappointed and feel like, as you so persistently quote John Lydon like a broken record, about the show why then do you keep watching it?
Have you noticed something about the nature of the universe and of life on this planet? its all very cyclical. civilizations rise and then they fall only to be replaced by another civilization as do starts and planets. Nature is very self corrective and something dies another thing must take its place. How many civilizations we had on thin planet in the past 10,000 years?, how many of them are lost for us and only remain as legends to us?. it seems to me, and please correct me if i am wrong, that your bitterness comes from the fact that maybe we will not have closure to this story and the cycle will repeat itself again and again just until the universe itself runs out fuel. how many times in life do you actually get closure? how many times in your life have you made the same mistakes your the former generation did. Sometimes in life you don’t get closure.
March 7th, 2009 at 4:29 am
“finally the next episode is here!!”….
1. Starts as usual with “previously……”
2. nothing happens… just some more alcohol abuse and sloppy paint job
3. End credits..
WTF!!??
March 7th, 2009 at 4:56 am
At first like some i was thinking Hera was going to suicide, and here i thought Adama drowning baby was dark.
And also after some thinking and wondering abut where that ship came from i thought of something. What if that uber giant purple cluster ship thingy was the ship the 5 resurrected on after earth and flew to the colonies, they would need a large ship, maybe one with enough fuel due to no ftl drives, and it doesn’t fit the norm for even advanced bio mechanical cylon technology or ships. It also may just be a freaky cylon home world or a base star factory.
As for Kara, what if her dad was daniel, a copy that got away, and maybe he ended up having a child and built or modified resurrection or something. Maybe the song he taught Kara was taught to him by Sam when he was being grown, or maybe it was implanted in there dna. Hell a 8 recited a line when she was 5 sec away from death in sick bay.
March 7th, 2009 at 6:33 am
Completely unrelated to this episode…It may be just another question that may never be answered. If the 13th tribe was all cylon then why would the leave a beacon in the Lion Head Nebula infected with a cylon virus along their journey to Earth from their exodus from Kobol?
March 7th, 2009 at 7:47 am
People People, “There’s a hole in the bucket, dear Liza”
This has to be the best ep so far for season 4.5 until next week. Yeah, I know it was not a lot of action but you have to appreciate what the writers are doing. This is an Opera of sorts and the music and tempo has been increasing every minute. I don’t want to hear any of you frak wits complaining about these eps. You must sit back and enjoy the opera as it unfolds in front of you. An now as I see this story progressing I can even appreciate the Deadlock ep. Because with out that story line these last few eps would not work.
Everyone, Kara, Saul and Ellen to name a few believe that Hera is the key. But what if they need Cavil to do whatever it is he’s going to do. Clone her, copy her DNA or dissect her to study her. Anyway, the clock is ticking on Hera’s life. She is so scared and I predict that so sort of power will be emitted from her because she is so frightened. It will be a self defense reaction to what cavil is planning.
Yes again there are problems in the story. What the hell happen to the chief? Did he flush himself down the toilet? Looks like we see racetrack ams skulls back in a raptor they must have been in the brig or something.
March 7th, 2009 at 8:05 am
So, some people aren’t happy about there being no big plot development related stuff in this episode. However, for me, the last few have been more like a jazz song. Sure, there’s no easy-to-get in your face plot development, but what you do get is lots of stuff happening in the back, under the melody, as it were. Lots of strings being wound up into one thread.
To me, that’s the mark of a great writer. It’d be easy just to do more reveals, and keep everyone happy, but in the end it wouldn’t be as satisfying. Like a great jazz piece, sometimes you need to have the quieter, more difficult to get parts, so that when you resolve them, you get the massive payoff at the end.
In terms of the people who say nothing happened this episode, I disagree. Here’s the stuff you didn’t seem to notice:
Helo (and probably Athena too) now has/have nothing left. Adama’s ship has died, and his partner is about to die, so he’s got basically nothing left to lose. Kara has lost Anders more than if he’d died. At least then he might come back. Now he’s a hybrid, who knows what happens next? Tyrol has lost the war with keeping the ship alive, and at the end of the last episode he lost Boomer completely, so he’s got nothing as well…
Basically, none of the crew now have anything left to fight for other than to see Cavil and his side die.
Also, the Galactica isn’t a human vessel anymore, nor is it a Basestar. In a very real way, it’s the technological equivalent of Hera; half human, half cylon.
We also got complete confirmation that it really, definitively was Kara that died.
Moving beyond that, the human and cylon crews of the Galactica no longer just live together, but die together as well.
Finally, there’s something that everyone seems to have missed. If the Galactica isn’t going to have any ammunition to face Cavil and Co. then how is it going to destroy them? Ram the Galactica into the colony, and use Raptors to escape? True, they don’t even need to get the Raptors out of Galactica, if they don’t care about the damage it does. They can just jump from inside her at the last second, and use the ship’s sheer bulk as a shield in the meantime. But somehow I don’t see that happening.
So my thoughts? True, the last few episodes have been more going for b-line story, but do I think that’s a bad thing? No. It’ll just make the tension and reveals in Daybreak all the sweeter.
March 7th, 2009 at 8:38 am
Folks,
This is what Mat and Nat wrote in the intro to this episode:
“The preview is pretty sparse on plot details”
They’re clairvoyant!
The reason the preview was sparse on plot details was because … well… this episode featured nothing more than a minor B story line inflated over 45 minutes.
The rest of the episodes better be a heck of a lot better or there’s no way I’m buying season 4.5 on DVD when it’s released.
March 7th, 2009 at 8:56 am
I loved this episode. They really got the characters to the place where they’ve let go of all they’ve been holding on to. Otherwise any unity they have w/ the Cylons at the end of the series will feel really false. This was totally necessary. I have no issues with character driven episodes. However, nothing is going to make me love Deadlock, and I’m a big Jan Epenson fan. Sorry, it was sucky character development. So for me it wasn’t action vs. character eps. I just didn’t like it.
And can I just say that Grace Park rocks! Man that woman can act. Wow! To make us feel sorry for that frakked up Admiral shooting, husband frakking, Chief gutting, baby stealing bitch is quite a feat!
I never felt one ounce of sympathy for the commander of Pegasus, but Boomer you’re killing me!
March 7th, 2009 at 9:35 am
This episode answered the most important question in SCIFI history!!!!!!!!
There is weed in space!!!!!!!!!
Seriously, I enjoyed this episode very much. All of the shows that Eddie has directed have taken on strong character develop. Helo had to come to gripps with the loss of his child and estrangement of his wife, while Adama slowly accepted the fate of his ship, but most importantly Kara continued to struggle with her destiny and what it means for the fleet.
The reason why we all love battlestar so much is that its different from other SCIFI shows that rely on explosions and space battles to push the plot forward. BSG is about the characters that occupy its universe. I suggest that everyone enjoy each slow moment to recongnize how much these people have been through because the end is coming fast.
March 7th, 2009 at 9:35 am
I’m in agreement with Kylon and Tron82. This was a TERRIBLE EPISODE. It was so bad, I think it’s now time to give Ron Moore’s Home Address to “Annie Wilkes”.
CLEARLY, Ron Moore has NO FRAKKING IDEA what he’s doing or where BSG needed to go in the end. For THREE WHOLE, PRECIOUS episodes (Deadlock, STWOM, IISOS) ABSOLUTELY NOTHING HAS HAPPENED. There have been NO REVELATIONS. WE HAVEN’T been shown EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED TO STARBUCK – ALL WE GOT was Baltar Diddling his Microscope and then some bull-crap about Kara actually coming back from “The Other Side”.
The “Colony” is a sloppy, brain-dead Deus Ex Machina which Cavil just CONVENIENTLY finds. (And HOW do we find out about this? We aren’t shown, it’s just spoken of in an off-handed way). ALL OF THE GOOD STUFF HAPPENS OFF-SCREEN and we’re only shown the same goddamn crap OVER AND OVER AGAIN. I don’t give a crap about Adama breaking down AGAIN AND AGAIN. I don’t want to see Roslin and Adama sharing Marijuana on her death bed in sick bay AGAIN. I want to see ALL of the Cylon Back Story WE’RE NOT ALLOWED TO SEE. I want to see when the Final Five Arrived at the 12 Colonies and what they did with the Centurians. Obviously, Ron Moore had no FRAKKING CLUE WHAT HE WAS DOING. Ron Moore does NOT have a firm grounding in Engineering and Scientific Concepts – which is why the Cylons were ALWAYS in SHADOW in the main story.
How ridiculous was it that Anders was hooked into a 60 year-old battlestar like it was a spanking new piece of advanced technology?! That the Cylons’ GOOP would turn the Battlestar into an advanced piece of technology and the Cylons not know IS BEYOND STUPID and INSULTING TO MY INTELLIGENCE. Did Anders SAY ANYTHING IMPORTANT? OF COURSE NOT!
Ron Moore isn’t going to explain a Goddamn thing! So ALL we got was a scene where our favorite Raptor-Adapter “Boomer” lands on the Deus Ex Machina that has antiquated Cylon Raider ships. She then CRIES A LOT (AGAIN. AGAIN. AGAIN.) about letting Cavil use the deli slicer on Hera. THIS WAS A NOTHING SCENE – simply because WE LEARNED NOTHING OF THE PLOT!!!
3 EPISODES OF NOTHING. I should have known that Ron Moore was nothing and would give us nothing. That new Star Trek movie is looking a whole-lot better now.
March 7th, 2009 at 9:41 am
Also, the preview for part 1 of the finale next week SHOWED YET ANOTHER SCENE on the Flight-deck of the Galactica where we get yet another Goddamn “rousing” speech by Adama. So, I daringly predict that we will get yet ANOTHER “set-up” episode which you lemmings will applaud and praise to the heavens.
It’s time to wake the hell up and realize the Ron Moore is poseur and completely fake. There is NO GRAND STORY HERE. The entire series has been a gigantic fraud.
March 7th, 2009 at 10:17 am
All of the plot developments in the last three episodes could have been condensed down into 15 minutes of show.
March 7th, 2009 at 10:19 am
That cylon mothership looked like a cross between a design from the alien movies and the mothership from Independence Day.Did anyone elese notice that classic cylon raider to? Also dont say the series has been a fraud. Im sure the best is being saved for the last.So say we All.
March 7th, 2009 at 10:28 am
The series IS A FRAUD, Centurion005. There have only been 4 watchable episodes this season. There have only been 4 episodes where something has actually happened. The last three episodes ARE COMPLETELY SUPERFLUOUS. Ron Moore HAD NOTHING TO SAY in them. The ENTIRE SERIES’ Value ENTIRELY DEPENDS ON THE ANSWERS TO ALL OF THE BIG QUESTIONS – WHICH RON MOORE HAS NO INTENTION OF ANSWERING. Saying that Kara Thrace “actually” “metaphysically” “resurrected”, which this episode seems to think is an answer, IS NOT AN ACCEPTABLE ANSWER!!!
I bet that Adama Breaks down and CRIES YET AGAIN IN THE NEXT EPISODE. And I’m sure that Jane Hackenson will find some way to have Adama cry in “The Plan” WHICH I HAVE NO INTENTION OF WATCHING.
R.I.P. Caprica.
March 7th, 2009 at 10:29 am
ok episode but none of this season (except the mutiny episodes) have been on par with season 1,2 or the best of 3. I can’t put my finger on why that is though. The plot is moving forward but the feel of the show is not quite what it used to be. A lot of people have pointed out there is a lack of an A story and they are trying to move too many little pieces forward without having one main story we can really latch on to. I agree. That’s not to say that the little pieces are not interesting or entertaining – mostly they are, but you need to have a little more depth to you can connect with the characters. We also have not seem much in the way of space battles or vipers which I miss.
It was good to see Baltar the scientist but I’m not buying Baltar’s outing or starbuck – made him less likable as a character. I find myself caring less and less about him. His head characters were so central to the arc of BSG and now I don’t care. I’m getting the same way with lee. He is supposed to be the main character in BSG and there has not been a Lee centered episode for a while. We see quick 20 second clips of him being the stand in president then off to another story.
They must have stopped by a Sherwin Williams on earth to get all that paint for galactica. Maybe the paint was on the cigarette and booze ship. Speaking of which, they must have stocked up on the pot to still have some from New Caprica.
Anyone get the Empire Strikes Back/Bespin City vibe when Cavil was shown on the colony? Is the colony BSG’s death star? Maybe C3PO is the one true god (first the ewoks now the cylons). If indeed galactica does end up ramming the colony, Hera with the ship miniatures was a little too much foreshadowing. Hope that was a mislead.
And I also thought Kara was going to kill herself, especially when you see Dualla’s picture. I thought she was going to put a gun to her head and go out just like Dualla so she could see if she comes back or not.
March 7th, 2009 at 10:43 am
In contrast to CJ I quite liked this episode and thought it was a marked improvement on the last 2 weeks, and I expected this and next weeks episode to be setup.
A few thoughts
1) Did anyone else think the planet Boomer initially jumped in by to was Jupiter
2) Given that Starbuck in Baltars opinion returned from the dead can the same process have happened to Baltar in the pilot given the dubious nature of his survival given that Caprica 6 was killed by the same blast
3) Why Bother painting the interior of Galactica? I would assume that other issues are more important
March 7th, 2009 at 11:08 am
Instead of “All Along The Watchtower” Ron Moore should have used Journey’s “Don’t Stop Believing” because I have the sense that he’s going to end the show the way “The Sopranos” ended.
March 7th, 2009 at 11:36 am
It may turn out more like the Matrix. There all on Earth in some tubes filled with slime and being used as batteries by the Cylons. There reality will turn out to be nothing more than a computer simulation.
March 7th, 2009 at 11:48 am
Ok So some thoughts….
So I finally begin to se where this season is going to end up. You can look at the blood on scales/Mutiny as the final break with the Colonial past. Now the original corium is gone as is for all intents and purposes President Roslyn. They were the last connection to the Colonies that is now gone. Everything is moving to a hybrid future…even BSG 75. It now has Cylon structure, connections and even its own hybrid.
His episode was extremely good as it seems to be setting everything up for an incredible final ride. We are inching toward what exactly is Kara and Baltar are, which I am putting my money on the archangels sent by the Gods. However I don’t think they are the only ones….I think there is one more because things always com in threes. I am going to put my money on bill Adama , he should not of survived when he got shot, no way no how…so maybe he actually died and then was brought back. Think about it Starbuck Baltar and adama are the three most important non cylon charters in the story.
I think the final three episodes we will see BSG 75 head out on one final mission to destroy cavil that much is obvious. However I think in the end we are going to find a situation similar to that at the end of B5 with the Vorlons and the shadows, the clyons and the humans have been manipulated by these “GOD’s” for their own purposes and their own war.
March 7th, 2009 at 11:48 am
First off i really liked the episode. i was a fan of TOS so now seeing the potential for other characters to show up from that show such as lucifer or maybe even the imperious leader excites me in a nostalgic/geeky way. also, i thought it was strange that the #8 that tigh spoke to said some of the song. does that make her the first of the s7 (or is that 8 now?) to be hearing it? something gives there i think. i am assuming that the “weed” was chamala but either way i thought it was funny. i do like adamas character but the drinking/crying fits are getting repetitious. colonel tigh as i have said from the very beginning is still the best character on the show. that’s my quick thoughts on the show.
March 7th, 2009 at 11:55 am
Check out this screen shot of the planet behind the ship with Boomer And Hera, and a side by side image of Jupiter.
http://clint.davis.to/files/Jupiter.jpg
It looks close, but not close enough to be a hint?
How many jumps did it take her to get there?
and how far away is the asteroid?
-Me thinks is not that far away, and like 1 jump by Galacta to get there.
Also Anders talks about the bucket (ship) having a hole.
- will he jump the ship once that is repaired.
Or do they use him as someone to control the ship to take it into battle.
(Was he repairing something by flickering the lights?)
March 7th, 2009 at 11:56 am
I think Gaius outed Starbuck because he believes the same thing happened to him on Caprica. He died and somehow came back exactly the same but has no memory of why or how. He has always been asking the same questions Starbuck does now, “Am I a Ceylon?” he knows he is significant but doesn’t know why. So he outed her because of his own nagging questions and also to bring attention to himself as usual. What’s unusual is Starbuck trusting him in the first place, I guess she wanted to put her situation out there, but she didn’t like the way he went about it. They have always had unique interactions, Starbuck has always reacted differently to him then anyone else did.
March 7th, 2009 at 12:20 pm
CJ is trying hard to win that alienware rig. You go CJ!
March 7th, 2009 at 12:27 pm
Oh and I have a good computer already. Dont need to sign me up.
March 7th, 2009 at 12:39 pm
Hey all,
I must say I really enjoyed these last two episodes. I can understand where all the negative comments come from, but I cannot agree with them. Battlestar Galactica has never been about the battles, or even, if you will, about the plot and answers to the many questions that the show asked us and itself during its four year run. That is not to say that the answers are irrelevant, because they are not. However, they aren’t central to the show. What is central, are the questions themselves, and what we, as audience, make of them. Some may find that frustrating, others rewarding. Therefore, I don’t think there is a right or wrong way of looking at the series. To those who are unsatisfied and bitter about the direction of the BSG, I can only say this: I know you once loved (and maybe still do love) this show. You have every right to feel the way you do, with a strong sense of regret because the show became something else from what it had been, something you are not comfortable with anymore. That is a valid standpoint, and I hope you guys find a show that will turn out to be everything you wanted to see on TV.
Me, I love the Galactica. I am deeply in love with it, and most of all, its characters, which is not to say that I am blind to the show’s flaws (Deadlock was certainly an abysmal episode). And precisely those characters are what elevates these last two episodes to such heights. Almost every character on the show was portrayed with deep care and attention, almost every scene crafted with emotion and love. Adama coming to terms (finally) with the fact that he will lose two greatest loves of his life; Lee stepping up (forcefully) as the real civilian leader of the fleet; Roslin content to live her final days, in her own words, at home; Starbuck, after the catharsis she experienced in the last episode, at long last letting go of the past.
Whatever BSG’s flaws are, and without a doubt there are many (it’s only a TV show, after all
), I’ve chosen not to care about them. The emotions, sincerity, strength of convictions and humanity of this show are the things I see when I watch it.
In two weeks, I’ll be sad to see it go.
March 7th, 2009 at 12:52 pm
Well..
The repeat of a cycle does not require the same players/actors/species/beings.
@The Presence
I am not bitter, but the underlining hope that all will be revealed in the last episode may be misplaced. Civilization is cyclic. And it repeats its self because mankind has remained unchanged for 100,000 years. We may know more but we still feel the same way, it is the last vestage of our struggle to conquer the animal kingdom. To expect the colonial cylons, who have only been around a few generation, to make the leap to higher beingness is too wishful. To expect the earth cylons, who have become truely human in all its pettiness, to make the leap to higher begingness is not the direction they are truely going. Only mankind (animal humans through and through) have a chance at higher beingness. Expecting a machine (cylon or hybrid, or cybrid) to show the way is to cop out on mankinds unique place in the universe. Only mankind can make itself into the higher beingness that the FF talk about acheiving. For mankind to wait or expect a machine to lead them is the height of laziness. Mankind is not ready to become gods, which is why the cylons are their weakness. Either mankind, and only mankind, makes the higher beingness leap or mankind dies out.
Within mankind’s soul is the perfections we seek. What we create by hand contains all our flaws. If cylons are really capable of higher beingness then they must do it on their own.
Mankind seeks his perfection with a creator God who does not interact on a material level. Because perfection is not in the material realm. And so the cylons must interact with a creator god who does not interact on a material level. Thats why the cylons created a one true god.
Mankinds hope for perfection is in the search for our perfect God. Cylons must seek a perfect god and as long as their flawed creators are around, they can not make the leap.
The cycle that BSG talk about maybe the leap to the immaterial. But it won’t be mankind and cylons. Only one of the two (man or cylon) will make the leap this cycle. The cylons will remain but this time they will have a immaterial/perfect creator (old mankind) to ascribe to emmulate. They too will create minions along the way and after a few annihilations be ready to make the leap.
You only feel cheated when you don’t get what you expect. Many here expect a union of cylon and man. I expect the final seperation of the creator and created. The parents (mankind) must move on and leave the children (cylons) alone with no further contact then a few stories. As for Hera, mankind has many stories of the half-human half-god creations (half-cylon half-human in this case). They don’t end with conversion to full-godhood but acceptance of the half-human and mortality; even when acheiving the greatness of Gilgamesh.
The series will seem to cheat us if we expect the story to remain the same with humans and cylons in the mix. In the end only one will be material (cylons) and the other (humans) will cross the threshold to higher beingness (LOK). Starbuck is a beacon to bring mankind to the threshold. Baltar is the cylons beacon to the threshold. Baltar will be the moses of the cylons; who must then wait for their time. He is the last (seemingly) human to die, since he does not cross over with the rest of mankind.
Challenge yourselves.
Can you accept that only one group will remain after the final episode?
If the questions are answered then what purpose can the series CAPRICA have?
After the last episode, will you comb the DVDs looking for what you missed?
Is it time to put aside childish things and become adults?
P.S.
100,000 years is approximate age of our anatomically modern linage of homo sapien.
Use of Capital God and lowercase god is meant to indicate worship of a deity by those who’s creator is not actually standing next to them in physical form (ie all cylons have lowercase god because their creators, humans, are actually standing next to them).
Not everyone who says nay is a pessimist. Get ready for the mindFRAK that the last episode will play out.
March 7th, 2009 at 1:05 pm
I’ve got a new theory as to Karas’ true nature. The Starbuck we all knew in the first three seasons was 100% human. Then she died. I believe Kara was sent back by who or whatever is pulling the strings. Sent back as a far more advanced verision of a head being. This would explain why she died yet still has her tattooes. The process erased her memory most likely. Moments like talking with her “Head-Dad”, was that higher entity helping her get on track with her mission.
She is the “Harbinger of Death.” Harbinger defines as “a sign of things to come.” She is dead, and death is something that comes to all of us.
“You will lead them all to their end.” Perhaps after Galacticas’ final mission Kara will be the highest ranking officer left and she will lead the rements of humanity to their new home.
****Lee talking about Kara being here with them seems like a setup for the head theory. Is she really there?
March 7th, 2009 at 1:10 pm
For me, this season has given me everything I want. I don’t really care that the story hasn’t run for the finish, I don’t want it to. I want to linger in this world and enjoy these characters I’ve spent the last five, nearly six years with. I like that the show has the guts to sit us with the characters and experience their interactions; something most TV shows and espically Sci-Fi takes no time to do what so ever. I love that it doesn’t limit itself to the standard format every week like other shows and allows itself to try and be different and creatively interesting with its cinematic style, direction and what it attempts to do with the story every week, even if its not successful.
I feel sorry for people who want concrete answers to the shows questions. Why do you need to understand the mechanics of Kara’s return or the head characters? Its not like we have the answers ourselves about how death and the afterlife functions beyond our own personal beliefs. Its not like anyone has an answer for how some people swear they see angels/ghosts or any number of phenomina beyond our limited understanding.
I think its a flaw in the sorta people like us, who love shows like this, that we feel a need to divide and search for answers for everything rather than just enjoy the entire picture its creaters are trying to paint. I’d argue that they aren’t insulting your intelligence by leaving things grey, rather they are asking you as a viewer to fill in the gaps yourself and allow the material to relate to you. Some will always be disappointed that plot points didn’t unfold in a way that was personally satisfying to them but its not ‘your’ story, its the characters in that universe’s story and that comes from the entire crew involved in the production of the show.
In other fun speculation:
They mentioned a cylon colony back in No Exit and haven’t we assumed all along since the miniseries that there was a cylon ‘homeworld’ somewhere. Doesn’t seem a big surprise to me that the secret cylon base has stayed secret till now. Besides, its not like they had all this figured out way back at the beginning, they tried plotlines, some worked and some didn’t.I can’t think of a reason not to introduce a big bad robot death fortress for the final CGI battle scene. I’m sure it’ll look awesome.
What did interest me though was the reappearance of Kara as the “one that will lead them all to their ends” as Hybrid-Sam said once again. Perhaps in light of this last episode we’ve had it all wrong. Death is no longer a negative anymore, in the context of a possible re-incarnation and hope in a life beyond. She faced her death, embraced it and wanted to go and she was reborn, ressurected for her sacrifice. Now that she has been revealed as a symbol of reincarnation to the people of the fleet, she could lead the people of the Galactica as a figure of hope and re-incarnation on their mission to rescue Hera. Sorta seems to lend even more creedence to her role as a symbol of the goddess Aurora and lead the human race to its end. However that end is also a new dawn, a rebirth/re-incarnation for humanity. Where the largest cycle of them all, the cycle of life and death can continue anew.
I’ve loved the show start to end, liked some episodes better than others and liked some characters better than others. But I’ve enjoyed this show consistantly for years and I can only thank those involved in its production through something as silly as this comment. I’ll miss it when its gone and I hope the end gives me the answers to leave me satisfied, but treats me enough like an adult to leave me with questions to consider for as long as it can.
Not bad for a first post.
March 7th, 2009 at 1:46 pm
I would hate to say I called it, but I did. Refer to my last post under the Someone To… thread. Anders will become the Galactica’s hybrid and take over all ship functions next week. Here is my input…
The song’s notes written out by Hera elude to the current location of the colony where John Cavil has taken Hera and Boomer.
This will be cleverly interpreted by Kara/Baltar/Final Five/Hoshi or somehow otherwise explained about a two dimensional drawing
equating to six or more spacial coordinates.
(Or, Boomer really liked getting some Helo and now sees Hera as her own child and escapes in a raptor/heavy raider with Hera
and returns to Galactica)
At the beginning of the episode Hera, “I (myself Hera), landed in stream of stars” and here is where I landed (the drawing/song notes)
is in the Galactica (cybrid projection) Combat Information Center and she is placing the Galacitca in the center of a group
of Cylon Raider and Baseship models (foreshadowing).
Adama knows that to jump to the coordinates indicated by the songs notes will be a one way suicide mission. He could risk five
hundred plus people (minimal force required to operate a Battlestar of that size) or network all of the ships systems and turn
control over to Anders. Reinforce the hull plating where the spacial distortion compromised it, then transfer all non-essential
personelle/supplies/tools/machinery and such to the civilian fleet.
A stripped down Galactica loaded with volunteer pilots/crew and controlled by the Hyrbid Anders jumps to the Cylon Colony and
all H. E. double hockey sticks breaks out. Anders controls Galactica and is connected to all other Hybrids plus he is a Final Five so
John Cavil is no longer running things. Anders conveys to the other Cylon Hybrids/Centurions/Raiders how they have been
played by Cavil for his own personal revenge against his parents.
PS: Kara is Daniel.
March 7th, 2009 at 1:51 pm
Favorite dialogue
In other words it is our destiny to go after her right? Wrong. I have had it up to here with destines, prophecies, with god or gods look at where it got us the ass end of no where.
Favorite bit of Acting
The expression on Lee’s face when a council member asks what does “Gaius Baltar have to say about this”.
March 7th, 2009 at 1:53 pm
Are Baltar’s ‘Angels’…. Being’s of Light? Is that what Starbuck and Baltar are? Anyone?
CJimison in Calif
March 7th, 2009 at 2:12 pm
Hey All,
Great episode, especially the way it ended–I love how they show 2 old friends, drinking, and looking tired, and old. It was great!
As for the rest of the episode, OMG! I would have liked to see some follow-up w/Tyrol, but the scene between Helo and Athena, and then Helo w/Adama–brutal. Helo is crushed for so many reasons: sleeping w/Boomer and being unable to tell the difference between Athena and Boomer. Then, he not only didn’t realize it, but lost Hera in the process. I don’t think Athena hates him, but she has been paranoid about losing Hera since the visions of the opera house where she gets taken by Baltar and 6. But hey, how much screwed upness can you take w/those 2? She realizes how she’s not human, at all, even though she’s made a family w/one, as there are copies, and her human husband still cannot tell the difference–brutal. Then , Boomer, sticking it to her w/loud aggressive sex right in front of her–so Athena has a reason to be angry. The main problem is the fear about Hera, and what will happen to her. Helo, just feels bad all around–poor Helo.
As for Kara–I think she subconsciously wanted Baltar to out her–she doesn’t trust him, so why would she have given the tags to him anyway? Look at how relieved she was after it happened; she didn’t even giving him a Kara punch, just a slap. I am not sure what it means to crossover, but I believe RDM has said that Baltar and Kara are connected, as I think Baltar crossed over as well. There is no way in the explosion on Caprica that 6 died and he did not, right?
The only shame on Kara’s face, was when she couldn’t look Lee in the face; because she was afraid of a)if he’d be angry for not being told by her or b) that he would shun her for being whatever she is. This is why he found her and told her he didn’t care, that all that mattered what that she was here now, and so was he; that was it. He said he didn’t care, and when he said that he saw the viper blow up, all of a sudden I realized that he never had any delusions that she was still the same Kara. That’s why I love Lee–and why that moment was so awesome as he was always the black & white guy, but no longer. Her death transformed him into the leader he is slowly becoming. She also was able to put of the picture of her as dead, as the person no longer existed. But when she goes back to see Sam, to figure out the patterns in the music and the picture, and says just that to Sam, she even says that she has finally accepted who she has become. I gotta say that I hate seeing Sam like that–that big gorgeous man a hybrid? Get him out of that tub!
But look at how people reacted to Kara, no one cares anymore, the lines are so blurred, people are so lost and confused. It’s so funny how the fight for survival is what kept people going and now w/out Earth, and the fight for survival is coming to an end, ie. they will win or lose. The sense of hoplessness is so palpable everywhere it is now at the last moments of life as they know it, it is the end. It is also interesting to see how the cylons are having the same issues, but everyone now wants peace–somehow.
I also find it interesting that Helo, was the first one to look at Athena, and say it’s you and me, no one else matters, which is what Lee says to Kara. I think that is how the fundamental question of what it means to be human has boiled down to; it doesn’t matter, what matters is you and the other person, and how you feel about eachother. So great!
Finally, Hera–I assume Cavil wants to make copies of her? I also think the pattern of the music is from Earth and Anders and I think that it is a map to their new home that is connected to the 13 original models. He talked about the music–but I don’t know how Ellen wouldn’t remember it–irregardless I think it will be the way they find a home and peace between the races.
be back later!
A
March 7th, 2009 at 3:17 pm
As overdramatic as CJ was, he is completely right. There has been absolutely no meaningful buildup of events over the course of the season, and arguably, the series. Good writing is not about dropping hints for four years and then showing your full hand at the last possible opportunity. It’s about intelligently constructing a web of expectations and guiding the drama so that it unfolds and evolves in a continuously intriguing and satisfying manner. This show has never sustained a long-term climax or build of events – we are merely shown small hints and then left to wonder perpetually.
In Season 1 Leoben showed up to tell us about Starbuck’s special destiny, Baltar was shown the Opera House on Kobol and told that he would know the truth – four seasons later we are still no more enlightened on these important, overarching plot points than when we were first introduced to them. The Opera House was not even mentioned against until Season Three. In last night’s episode Anders tells Kara she is the harbinger of death. Yes, that has been established for well over a year now, and we still know nothing more about what it means than when we first heard it uttered in Razor. This is essentially – for lack of a more tactful term – literary cockteasing. Whether or not there is something meaningful and captivating behind these “plot carrots” dangled in front of our noses, it is simply a matter of poor design to bring up these elements again and again with absolutely no intention to follow through, meanwhile expecting the audience to find them intriguing on a long-term basis despite never having been shown anything of true significance. Sporadically bringing these points up, as if only to remind us that they exist (as they are given attention so infrequently) is not a meaningful build of events or a well-constructed story. It is the writers essentially trying to captivate us with these plot points while expending as little effort as possible to construct meaningful arcs for them.
Of course, Battlestar’s main strength has been shown to be its characters first and foremost. As a character drama it is a wonderful piece. If you are watching because you want to be captivated by some meaningful long-term plot development, well, that may or may not happen. (In my consideration the only true continuously developing long-term arcs were from Kobol’s Last Gleaming to Home, and Downloaded to Exodus.) However, if you watch because you want to experience genuinely good character writing, you will be well-treated. As much as I do like to have them, considering the half-hearted attempts at creating these series-wide elements of intrigue and deeper meaning I feel as though the show may have been better served without them. They merely serve to continuously frustrate and disappoint those whose interest they have piqued, and detract from the pure character drama that could have otherwise been focused on exclusively. I could totally watch another 80 episodes of Tigh experiencing internal turmoil, cracking rad lines, and throwing ambrosia bottles at walls. I could watch Starbuck slam an indefinite number of men into urinals, and follow the continued emotional development of Adama with rapt attention. I’d watch the show even if it was just a single camera following Baltar around all day, just to see what so interesting a character does and says.
I realized the deficiencies in Battlestar’s overarching plot points a long time ago and resolved to go into the final season only to see what happens to these characters and not necessarily to get the long-awaited follow through on these long-ignored plot points. So, despite the vague irritation that rings in the back of my mind with each episode those threads are blatantly ignored, I’m going to go into the finale hoping the characters I love are well served and to get a satisfying emotional payoff on each of their journeys. I think if everyone does the same we’ll end up enjoying the conclusion to our beloved series a lot more. In the end, this really is just a good old character drama.
March 7th, 2009 at 3:27 pm
@CJ:
I am RIGHT THERE WITH YOU! Bravo on your commentary. I too feel like RDM has been frakkin with us. I really appreciate the fact that he was able to deliver an AWESOME sci-Fi show that was able to entertain and punch us in the gut a number of times during the past four seasons. But so far Season 4.5 has pretty much SUCKED, with a few exceptions. I thought the writing and exposition of “A Disquiet Follows My Soul” and “Blood on the Scales”, were brilliant in their sheer intensity and pure adrenaline rush. And I’m hoping, GAWD–*really* hoping that everything DOES NOT end with some stupid cliffhanger ending the way The Sopranos did. RDM was a huge fan of that show, so who knows what he’ll do with BSG.
Like most of us, I have truly come to love these characters and would love to see them ALL HAVE CLOSURE of some kind. I’m so frakkin SICK AND TIRED of this ridiculous “song and dance” crap around Starbuck’s TRUE self. Same goes for Baltar. Don’t we all deserve to know MORE? Some of the comments above make my stomach turn because it seems that some of you are being far too “forgiving” and “all embracing” when it’s shockingly clear that we all may be being played. I know that’s a hard pill to swallow, but well, there it is. Trust me, I’m NOT bashing this incredible show. I have applauded it and loved it and embraced it since Season One. But why should I suddenly settle for BAD writing, when I feel I deserve so much more than what these last few eps have given me?
I am sooooooooooo hoping that I will choke on all these words after seeing the last two eps, believe me! I WANT to be proven wrong about my overall trepidation with how this show is going to end. I WANT Mr. Moore to kick me in the teeth and curl my toes with his hopefully brilliant denouement. PLEASE PROVE ME WRONG RDM!!! PLEASE DON’T DISAPPOINT ME OR INSULT MY INTELLIGENCE. This show has been absolutely gripping, top notch television, but I’m feeling more like I’m going to be shaking my head from total incredulity and disappointment, instead of standing on the foot of my bed yelping and cheering from complete satisfaction.
I don’t want to start comparing RDM with JJ Abrams and George Lucas. But that fat lady starting to sing.
And maaan, is she in the WRONG key.
March 7th, 2009 at 3:57 pm
Answerless in a Stream of Clues…
Well, there wasn’t a lot a lot of action (again) – or many answers in this episode (again) – but we were given several more clues (again). So much time and so little to do. Strike that. Reverse it…
Ah, Jupiter and what a pleasant site she is…
Thanks to that image of our very own neighborhood gas giant, I have “resurrected” at least a glimmer of hope that “our” Earth will play a part in the BSG finale and that the Thirteenth Tribe’s “Earth” and our own Earth are not one and the same. We may all be “Cybrids” after all and not even know it – yet.
I liked Hera’s apparent foreshadowing of the destruction of Galactica in the beginning of the episode followed by the Admiral and Tigh’s touching toast to her at the end (that was BSG at it’s best). There may indeed be a “hole in The Bucket”, but Galactica is going to meet her end in glorious fashion! Watch out Cavil – she’s coming for ALL of you!
Of course, there could be another meaning to Hera’s playing with the model ships if you consider that she seemed to GENTLY move the Galactica and Cylon Basestar together – which could also symbolize the union between the Humans and rebel Cylons in the fleet. Lee said that the personnel and military equipment of the Galactica would be merged together on the Basestar under Admiral Adama’s command.
Getting back to “There’s a Hole in the Bucket”…Aside from the clever parallel to the Galactica and the gaping hole in her side, the song itself is a classic infinite-loop motif and a reference to the concept of “eternal recurrence” whereby events in the universe will continue to recur in a “self-similar” way an infinite number of times. This is a paraphrasing of what the First Hybrid said in Razor:
“As my own existence comes to a close, only to begin anew, in ways uncertain.”
Another interesting point is that the Humans conducting repairs on Galactica don’t believe that the Cylon goo is having any restorative effect on The Bucket – but it did enable Anders to network himself into the ship. Some transformation is happening within the Galactica – but to what end?
Even though we found out what Kara isn’t in this week’s episode (maybe), we still don’t know what she is (definitely). “Alas poor Kara, I knew her, Baltar”. She’s the dead chick who isn’t dead. It’s starting to become a little frustrating – kind of like Tony Micelli and Angela Bowers stagnantly lame relationship after 8 seasons of “Who’s the Boss” (I’m sure nobody saw that analogy coming – sorry about that – really sorry). These are desperate times! RDM, please tell us what Kara is already – and don’t pull a Soprano’s non-ending on us! On the positive side, Kara hasn’t lost her edge – that scene with her talking to Baltar while on the pot was great. It was also very emotional to see her place her picture on the wall after talking to Lee. That scene also re-established the deep connection between Lee and Kara that transcends the physical (hmmm, Apollo and Artemis – “it doesn’t matter”). Anyway, pressing on…
We know that Kara returned to the fleet in a brand new Viper seemingly leaving her old bird – and corpse – behind on the surface of the “Earth” of the Thirteenth Tribe. When we FINALLY learn what Kara is and what brought her back to life (assuming she really died) we may also learn the process that restored (or re-created) her new Viper. Would it be too much of a Disney ending for Galactica to also be restored to brand new condition by the same phenomenon? Probably, especially with RDM wielding the pen on these final scripts…
After seeing Boomer cry when Hera called out for her, Boomer has clearly become the frontrunner for transformation and redemption. At the darkest hour, when Galactica, the fleet, and her rebel Cylon allies have exhausted every option and their entire cause is on the brink of absolute destruction at the hands of the sadistic Cavil, Boomer will redeem herself by helping to save Hera and defeat Cavil.
This final, climactic battle may become a “War of the Gods” with the angels and demons taking sides in a classic conflict of “good verses evil”. Hopefully, we won’t see Abraham Lincoln sitting in his chair floating about in space during the final battle. That would really spoil the *ahem* realism for me.
Could the First Hybrid be alive and on Cavil’s “Colony of Doom”? There was at least one old school Cylon Raider – used by the Guardians – on the landing pad. Could Cavil then use the First Hybrid to learn the secrets of the prophecies – including Kara Thrace’s true identity/purpose – and use it against the Humans and rebel Cylons? Remember, the Guardian Basestar was on the ice planet during the First Cylon War and was conducting “inhuman” experiments on the Human passengers of the Diana (Roman equivalent of Artemis). There are lots of possible implications to be derived from that single image.
BTW, I didn’t love the design of Cavil’s base, but I don’t know what I was expecting. It’s kind of like HR Giger crossed the interior of the Borg Cube from “First Contact” with the alien Mother Ship from “Independence Day” and threw in a few horns on the exterior to add a “demonic flair” to the design – just to make sure we know who the bad guys are.
Overall, I liked this episode and there were several memorable, and very well done scenes. There were, however, a few notable absences…
What’s happened to Tyrol? How’s he holding up since his betrayal by Boomer. What is he doing about it? Napping I guess.
What is going on in Dogsville? We were supposedly on the verge of a revolution – but it seemed awfully quiet down there. I thought there was a new sheriff in town with Big Guns. “Badges? We don’t need no stinking badges” – just give me the guns!
And I still believe “Adama is a Cylon.” But which Adama??? It could be the Admiral (least probable and most cliché), Lee, Dualla or Zak (Most probable – according to IMDb he was scheduled to re-appear in this episode).
I’m still waiting for Number Three (a.k.a. D’Anna Biers) to return…do we REALLY know the actual F5? D’Anna knows. Maybe we won’t need her and RDM will show us enough of the visions from the Opera House so we can see for ourselves. But we could use Xena’s help in the coming battle. If not, maybe RDM could get her to sing the national anthem on screen. It wouldn’t advance the story, but it would be entertaining – and that is, after all, the primary reason for the show.
Well, we have another week to theorize and ponder the truth…”I love it. God help me I do love it so.”
Tiberius1111 out.
Thanks for reading and your kind response.
March 7th, 2009 at 4:12 pm
Also I for got to add to my previous post:
I think the drawing Hera gave to Kara is the Star map of jumps to the Colony Ship (basically like leaving bread crumbs to find her) and the the other semi-circle drawing will be used by Helo and Athena when they realize Hera left it for them, this combined with Starbucks box of artifacts Helo recovered for her. And… drum roll…… Saul has made some BOLD statements about what he holds important to Ellen and the rest of the crew. Ellen has yet to ‘listen’ to him and ACCEPT what he has chosen dear. She is always trying to convince him to do the opposite, Tori too (she has no guts)! He does not need to accept any other principals. He knows who he is and who has his back. I can’t see him turning on Adama ever, I could be wrong, but I don’t want to be. I made an emotional connection with the final scene of the episode. Two great leaders coming together, two great warriors that have travelled a path to save humanities children. It’s who they are, they don’t care about what crib they crawled out of. You gotta love it!
CJimison
P.S. I hope Baltar tests his own blood, soon! That bite of reality would really cement his followers. He literally couldn’t take all the love. What is he going to do with all those guns? They gave him a nuke, now ‘big guns, really big guns’. Six is the only honest relationship he had on this ride from the beginning. I don’t think in the final minutes we have left he is going to grow a pair. He is a coward and would leave it all behind for the love of a Six!
March 7th, 2009 at 4:38 pm
Did anyone notice when Kara was walking in to see Sam how the light changed behind her. First she was outlined in white light and then it changed to red. Angel or devil? Is the the ending she is leading them all to their new world or their deaths??? And yes, those definitely where not new raiders.
March 7th, 2009 at 5:26 pm
There problaby going pegasus in to the base, afther a “hub” boardig party whit Helo and athena. the oprahouse is something Hera created.
There problaby not going to use all on the deck in the promo, only pilots and needed personel, not Cottel and so on..
maybe the 4 and 5 turns on Cavil. Rosolin is not going to die in the bed whit a book but whit a bang…
The question is whos going to die and who not, maybe adama is the dying leader and instead of leading them to earth, he leads them to peace.
———————————————————————————————————————————————————————————
from the battlestar of norway: Snowstar/Snystjærno
March 7th, 2009 at 5:49 pm
About Jupiter. Could the storm that kara went through be a wormhole connected to the storm on jupiter? An eye of jupiter reference? Perhaps karas not an angel but instead from a parallel universe were earth is not destoryed.As in our Earth and our universe.Im also thinking the final scene in the whole series could be something like the return of the jedi. Were we see all the “ghosts” of people who died glowing in light. And standing in the middle will be Jesus.
March 7th, 2009 at 5:49 pm
First, I give Islanded in a Stream of Stars a B grade.
So, really there is ONE episode left. The last two weeks are essentially a single three hour episode broken into two parts. I have full faith in RDM and that he will give us a grand finale. I have assumed for a while that RDM was saving the juicy stiff for the final 3 hour episode but I wish there was more in the previous three.
Deadlocked had great info but was really slow. Someone to Watch over Me was a lot better, but the first half was slow. And again last night, Islanded in a Stream of Stars had some great info, but almost all of it was in the last 10 minutes. I think the three episodes could have easily been edited into two and we could have had a four hour finale. But all three episodes added to the BSG legacy and are good television. These slower three episodes are the calm before the storm to come: Daybreak
I like the comments posted here saying these episodes were like jazz or an opera. So much TV is like a boring 80’s song. It’s fun but more production than talent. BSG has been a great work of art. We need the story and character development.
As has been said here already, societies rise and fall…BSG has always been about the fall of the human society. It questioned our war in Iraq, abortion, suicide bombers, our dependence on technology, who we elect as leaders, facing death, on and on and on…and now drug use. BSG is great action, compelling drama, Bear’s awesome music, thought provoking social commentary and killer special effects.
I think those complaining just want answers and special effects. Today we just download the singles and not the whole album. That’s OK for Brittney Spears, but not for Miles Davis. BSG is a complete story with a few slow parts. When it is released I will buy the final boxed set of BSG and watch it over and over again.
So… Everyone is dead inside so let’s die outside…and kick Cavils ass on the way.
Cavil has Hera and it sounds like he wants to make copies of her? Was that a ship or an asteroid turned into the Cylons new colony? It looks like old style cylons are coming back? Starbuck is an angel…then is Baltar an Angel? And will RDM tell us if she is half Cylon?
I see the scene where she puts her picture back on the “wall of lost souls” as her accepting that she is dead. Lee says that’s ok, he’ll take Angel Kara as she is.
Boomer, good and bad…like all of us.
Anders is hooked into the ship and Adama is abandoning ship. Hmmm?
@ Fox McCloud: Two weeks left of BSG. One episode left. It will be in two parts. One will be a single hour episode and the other a two hour episode. On April 21st we get Caprica on DVD. In June we get The Plan (A view of season 1 and 2 from the Cylon perspective).
March 7th, 2009 at 6:48 pm
Hi, JJC1970. Yes, I’m also wondering what will happen to Galactica – here’s an alternative to a glorious ending during the final battle…
A newly organic and recently abandoned Galactica, complete with a fully networked Anders hybrid, begins to hear the Cylon Song (”All Along the Watchtower”). “Anderstar Galactica” is switched on, becomming self aware and jumps away into deep space to begin anew in ways uncertain…
…and the little daggit (dog) laughed to see such sport and the Bucket ran away with the tune.
March 7th, 2009 at 7:11 pm
Well the planet did look like Jupiter but that rock right behind it wasn’t Saturn.
Solar system chart. http://www.nineplanets.org/overview.html
March 7th, 2009 at 7:46 pm
Anyone that knows anything about writing knows that climaxes are nothing without some sort of rising action. As much as we would all love to have answer after answer thrown at us it ultimately would not make for a good ending. These past few episodes may have been slow but they are setting the stage as well as increasing our bond to the cast. It will make the finale feel all the more climatic and resolute. It will leave a feeling that could not be gained if they just arbitrarily threw out answers time after time again.
I also find it odd that some of you have been watching the show since the start and still don’t understand this idea. Why have you kept on for this long to suddenly turn on it at the end? I’m sorry you are unhappy with how things are going but this is Ron’s story to write. If you don’t like how it’s going, you might as well give up on it now.
March 7th, 2009 at 8:19 pm
Season four has been RUSHED, thats all! A potentially epic story has been crushed down to four seasons rather than the usual 6, or 7! Thats why every thing is so conveniently covered! A Cylon colony you say, could have done with knowing about that as soon as you arrived Ellen! Its not that these character driven episodes are slow, not at all! Its just the fact as BSG fans we were spoilt with episodes that had time to have the drama and maintain a fair bit of the action! I love this show, I will purchase the final box set when its released! But I know that there was always at least one more seasons worth of Battlestar to be enjoyed!!!!
March 7th, 2009 at 8:37 pm
Cairo, nobody wants them to reveal all the big, final answers before the last episode. The issue is that we know absolutely nothing more now about the fundamental questions of the series than when those questions were first introduced. We were told Starbuck is special, but there has been zero development on that initial statement since it was known to us, just a bit of treading in the water now and then to remind the audience that the writers have a super deep and mysterious plan that they have no interest in actually expounding upon. You mentioned build-up, but there has been none. The plot points were never developed in a meaningful fashion, they just throw us a bone once or twice a season and proceed to write a few more mutiny-related story arcs. The “mythical” elements of the series were not intelligently constructed or well handled, not by a long shot.
March 7th, 2009 at 9:16 pm
Im sure if they have any unanswered questions still left they will be answered in Caprica. What they should do instead of having a show called Caprica is have the show be called Earth.It would show that Seti made contact with Kobol, and how the Kobolians sent them instructions for making ships that travel at the speed of light. During the same time all the major companys laid off and replaced all there human employees with newly built centurions in the year 2030.This made the economy totally collapse which was followed by WW3 braking out which made the Cylons rebel against the humans. And thats where you have the F5 leaving to warn the kobolians not to make there own A.I.S
March 7th, 2009 at 9:46 pm
Ok, good episode, good character expositions.
Still… they saved ALL for the grand finale, which is understandable… just hope it lives up to it!
Oh, I really liked Kara’s smile after Lee talked to her, I though cuteness had died with Cally, but nope Kara has some cuteness too!
PS: hope Galactica blows up with adama, roslin and many others inside.
PS2: what happened to Tyrol? He was suspiciously absent from todays ep… in the brig?
PS3: also, I wanna see some centurions!! They have also been mysteriously absent since… well, since before I can remember, they are supposed to be all sentient now (at least the ones with the rebels)
PS4: nope, nothing else.
March 7th, 2009 at 10:19 pm
Hi, Tycho.
A few ramblings in response to you Post Scripts…
PS: Galactica will be abandoned and with the help of the Anders Hybrid and a generous slathering of Cylon goo, will be transformed into the organic “Anderstar Galactisam” whose mission will be to travel the galaxy and sing children’s rhymes. Or, the Bucket will blow up during the final battle and kill a bunch of Humans and Cylons. Not sure which – it is really a toss up at this point.
PS2: Tyrol is napping. Actually, I believe that it was posted in Bear McCreary’s blog that Tyrol is in the brig for his role in helping Boomer escape and kidnap Hera. So yes, he probably is really napping right now. That scene was – shockingly – cut from the final version of the episode that aired on SciFi.
PS3: All Cylon Centurions were fired due to budget cuts in response to the global economic crisis which has now spread into deep space – AND sentience has made the Centurions very camera shy.
PS4: There is no official release date for the PS4 (Playstation 4), though many “techpreneurs” believe that it will not be launched before 2011.
Hope this helps…
March 7th, 2009 at 10:34 pm
Once again I am disappointed at the complaining about the greatest show on TV. All you traders will get the airlock if I was the admiral. LOL!
Anders transformation has been explained before but we have never seen this happen. The hybrids are considered by the cylons to be touched by God or to have seen his face. This will cause them to go mad. Anders was shot in the head and within inches of his life. We hen he was brain dead he was dead and he crossed over. Then something brought him back this is why he is now like a hybrid. Also did anyone notice elements of anders coming out within the hybrid like ramblings. I wonder is this how they create the cylons.
Also the F5 my be able to show up at the cylon colony and the original toasters will have to stand down. If the F5 made an agreement with the toasters to stop the war this my still stand and Cavil will have to war with his new style toasters against the old style toasters.
Just a thought…………..
March 7th, 2009 at 10:41 pm
Hera, already showed us the end, the Battlestar will ram into the colony and game over. Adama will Slim Pickens his way to doom. YAHOOOOO!!!!
March 7th, 2009 at 11:03 pm
Whoever is driving the galacitca at ramming speeds into the colonony mothership be it either anders or adama will have either “to be or not to be ” or better yet “Cry Havoc, and let slip the dogs of war” as their final lines. Would be a neat ST:VI reference. I looked up the poem that the dogs of war line is from and it actualy reminds me alot of the plot of this episode.
Blood and destruction shall be so in use
And dreadful objects so familiar
That mothers shall but smile when they behold
Their infants quarter’d with the hands of war;
All pity choked with custom of fell deeds:
And Caesar’s spirit, ranging for revenge,
With Ate by his side come hot from hell,
Shall in these confines with a monarch’s voice
Cry ‘Havoc,’ and let slip the dogs of war;
That this foul deed shall smell above the Earth
With carrion men, groaning for burial
“Their infants quarter’d with the hands of war” This line fits perfectly with the plot being that hera will be what the battle is about. The line “That this foul deed shall smell above the Earth” also fits in quite well to for obvious reasons.I doubt rdm will have this as a reference but it coincidentally fits surprisingly well with the plot.
March 7th, 2009 at 11:35 pm
Hi, Centurion005 – great quote, it’s one of my favoirtes and squeezing a little Trek reference into BSG wouldn’t hurt anything, right?
I also like “Damn the torpedos, full speed ahead!” said by Adm. David Farragut. It’s missing the Trek reference, but it sounds like something Admiral Adama might say at the end (IMHO)…
March 8th, 2009 at 1:29 am
Ok, random thought:
Wouldn’t it have been really cool and nice to have seen a photo of Felix Gaeta up on that memorial wall? I mean, come on! The guy should AT LEAST be remembered in that way, and I truly think the writers missed an opportunity to have paid homage to poor Felix.
And having his photo on that wall would have been a nice tribute, albeit a quiet one. Bad enough there wasn’t enough time to go into everybody on Galactica’s shock, outrage and sadness over everything that developed with Felix’s story.
I mean, it was Gaeta, for crying out loud. No matter how much of a bastard he turned out to be, the writers definitely should have dealt more with the aftermath of the mutiny. I’m just saying.
March 8th, 2009 at 3:17 am
Thoughts on Stream of Stars:
* Loved Hera in CIC playing with the model ships. Quick question: dream sequence? Projection? As far as we’ve seen, Hera’s never been into the CIC before. Loved WatchTower playing slowly in the background as she plays.
* The meeting with the bigwigs was nice. Although Tory said NOTHING, but the camera kept panning to her. Were we meant to qonder why she was there, without Galen, and come up with the explanation he was in the brig. A throw away line would have been good to explain it. Seeing as how Cavil later spelt it out to te audience that he’d set up Ellen to be fooled by Boomer, when, really, it was completely unnecessary, we’d kind of figured it out. Interesting that the writers will often think we’re kinda stupid, and at other times give us too little information and expect us to guess.
* Good to see Lee in yet another new suit. Anyone remember early in the series when Roslin was saying she only had about three outfits. Where the heck is Lee getting all these perfectly fitting, perfectly ironer suits, with matching ties from?
* Yay for Kara coming to Hera’s defense in the meeting. Interesting that she confessed to knowing the song that switched on the F5. Why did no one ask her why her father would have known it? That would have been my first question for her. Although, is Kara trying so hard to convince Adama because she’s genuinely concerned for Hera, or because she still wants answers for herself? Although, I will give her the benefit of the doubt here, and believe that she wants Hera back alive and safe. or at least away from the Cylons…
* Aww, Helo, I just wanted to hug him the whole damned episode. He is never getting laid ever again. Poor kid. Broke my heart.
* Gauis’s speculation about angels is extremely interesting. Considering who Kara saw last week, and what Baltar was saying about ‘those nearest and dearest’ and who can guide them back to the road to salvation. It’s interesting. One also must wonder how right Caprica Six was about saying that Baltar hadn’t changed. It’s something that I’ve wondered the entire series. Has he genuinely become a humanitarian, or is he still playing the masses in the hopes of saving himself. “You haven’t changed Gauis. Not really.” Would hearing that from someone who he believes he loved, have the impact to change him.
* Random Eight calling Tigh her father is very interesting. Loved the ‘So Much Confusion’. What does that mean for the Significant Seven and the Elusive Eighth? Does that mean they knew the song as well?
* Boomer…needs to be hit early in the episode. Smack her with something heavy. Seeing her yell at Hera seemed so insanely out of character for her. I mean, kids crying is annoying as all get out, and can cause lunacy like never before, but the hatred she spews at Hera is not something I would have expected from Boomer. Trying to work out just who she’s betrayed more is quite easy. Herself. She’s betrayed herself more than anyone before. She’s tried desperately to fit into each of the groups. She didn’t have the chance to redeem herself with Galactica before Cally shot her, and she hated being a Cylon until New Caprica. She tried to integrate the societies, and failed miserably. Not human, not cylon. I still can’t fathom just why she turned to Cavil, and sided with him in the war. She was hurt and angry, but I can’t see her condoning the genocide of both humans and cylons. Seeing her starting down the path of redemption is very interesting. Even money on the speculation that Boomer will die trying to save Hera and get the girl back to Athena. It’s the only real way she could possibly end the series.
* Hera being able to project is extremely interesting. Has she always been able to do that.
* I LOVE Kara and Baltar’s scene in the head. Awesome! Kara peeing while talking to Baltar is classic.
Gauis’s genuine belief in angels. He doesn’t seem to be lying. If he see’s head-Six as an angel…does that mean he genuinely also believes in the one true god?
Fave quote: “Regularity…that must be important when you’re full of crap.”
Also…does Baltar really not remember Kara? Sure, she’s one anomg many of the women he’s slept with…but damn that would hurt. Seeing as how sleeping with Baltar was one of the turning points for Kara in season one, she’d probably be pissed that he wouldn’t remember. Unless he was just trying to hurt her.
* Kara with the gun with Sam!! RAH!! I’m a bit of a Sam/Kara fan, cos Sam’s just so awesome. Seeing Kara admitting to, well, not loving Sam, cos she never actually says ‘love’, but the emotion for her is real. “You are my Sam.” Beautiful. Until she pulls the gun of course. Heh. But, it was good to see her actually admitting to feeling something for him.
As for what Sam says, I THINK this is it:
“The neuro anatomy for fear or faith shares common {…}
Flip a coin, increase, increase vascular pressure marks that’s {..} response.
Free will scuttles the response of fear for that fear to work.
You are the harbinger of Death Kara Thrace.
You will lead them all to their end. End of line.”
{…} were bits I could not, for the life of me, get. The first had Kara dropping her gun in the goo, and the second was just rushed.
Loved that he looked directly at Kara to say the harbinger of death bit. Means we haven’t seen the last of the prophecy, despite the fact that destroying the hub was supposed to have been part of the prophecy (despite Kara not having anything to do with the actually destruction of Cylon property…)
“A closed system lacks the ability to renewitself. Knowledge alone is a poor primer. — hole in the bucket. End of Line. Begin reintegration of right hemisphere command subroutines … There’s a hole in the bucket, dear Eliza, dear Eliza. There’s a hole in the bucket. …. patternd and repetitions. All of this has happened before and will happen again.”
* Six totally knew where Cavil moved the Colony to. She looked like a kid caught with her hand in the cookie jar. Too innocent. There’s no way she doesn’t know.
* Helo and Adama…*sighs* Helo needs a hug. He’s so TALL! And why are suicide missions okay for Adama but not for Helo. Interesting that Helo uses the words “hole in this bucket”. Is there something more we should be wondering about Helo? Considering the fact that the Cylons were trying to breed with humans and only Helo managed to get an Eight pregnant and have the child brought to term. So…is there something special about Helo, or is it just coincidence that he uses the same words that Sam-brid used?
* I found Adama to be a little unsmypathetic to Helo actually.
* Baltar outing Starbuck. Interesting. Very interesting. Why? What made him do it? Does he genuinely believe in eternal life? (Even the most flawed amongst us.) Also interesting to compare what Baltar says here to what head-Not-Leoben said to Kara in Maelstrom.
Baltar: “Courage to face death. Embrace it even. Only then, will we truly have the ability to cross over.”
Leoben: “You want to cross over but you’re afraid…of the unknown. Death.”
*Watch Ellen and Tigh’s reactions to Baltar’s revelation about Kara. They’re fuzzed out, but Ellen is totally shocked. She has no clue what the hell is going on. She has the memories of earth, but she doesn’t know what Kara is. Then again, earth is awfully big, so who’s to say that someone on the other side of earth didn’t have the same idea as Ellen did. Who’s to say that just because the F5 all knew each other and preared for the end of the world that they were the only ones. Earth’s an awfully big place, and someone else may have had the same idea, the same theory, the same information. So…who knows.
“She’s not a Cylon, they’ve already been revealed to us.” SMACK! Loved it.
(Also, just for kicks, check out the girl over Kara’s choulder just after the smack who nods her head in solidarity for the slap as everyone else stands stunned. She’s fun.)
* I didn’t want to enjoy the schmoopiness of Lee and Kara at the wall, but damned if I didn’t like it. It’ll be interesting to see how that particular love triangle gets resolved know that Dee’s out an airlock and Sam’s a hybrid. If they get together jst because their partners both got bullets to the brain, I’ll be annoyed. Am I the only one who’s cheering for Sam to win?
* They’ve hit us over the head with the lighting on Kara twice now. Being back lit by the bright white lights, once seen by Sam, and the second time as she goes in to see Sam-brid. Anyone else notice the same lighting on Lee…’Adama is a Cylon’. So, yes the Cylons have been revealed, but we’ve seen Kara, who we assume is a cybrid, being backlit like an anvil-sized hint…should we just have forgotten about Leoben telling Roslin about Adama back in S1? Was he lying? Was he just trying to cause trouble? Or should we still be asking ourselves, now that ther’es an Elusive Eighth, if Adama is back in the game.
* What’s with the purple Colony? Why is it purple! There’s never been anything purple with the cylons. RED, people! RED!
* Wondering what ‘all sorts of new playmates’ Hera will be having. If thos ships were ye olde cylon models, what will crop up next week. The F5 gave the cylons the knowledge to build organic-form, and the Res.Tech as well. We know from Razor that some stuborn olde Cylons wanted to work it out for themselves, and were still conducting experiments. Did these Cylons (well, not the Razor ones, cos they were blown up) but did any of these ypes ever manage to work it out themselves, and make their organically created Cylons able to procreate naturally both within their own species, and without? Is Cavili talking about other children, newer models, other centurions, olde centurions, Caprican Farm babies…hmmm…
* Interesting to see the Adama painting scene hark back to Kara’s painting scene in Maelstrom. That’s quite a few references to Maelstrom we’ve had, first from Baltar, and now from Adama, not to mention little Kara from last week.
I don’t actually mind that instead of getting answers, we’re getting bits and pieces. It’s interesting to put the pieces together. I felt as though the ep ‘No Exit’ gave too much information and left little to mystery. Then again, we’ve only got two to go, and a lot that still has yet to be answered.
All in all, not a bad episode. Still not answering everything we want answered…but then, why would we watch Caprica and ‘The Plan’ if they answered everything right now? They need to keep usguessing until the very end. 14 days and counting…
March 8th, 2009 at 3:22 am
It seems to easy that blowing up BSG inside the the Cylon Colony is the end game and the human and rebels cylon with live happily ever after. It reminds me of the original Star Wars where the Death Star was destroyed but the imperial fleet remained. Taking out the colony isn’t going to take out all of the “millions of Cylon children”.
One of the things that has never been explained to my knowledge is why the Centurions are subservient to the skinjobs? Cavil seemed terrified when the Centurions were allowed the process of free thought (just before he was executed).
It has not been explained if there are still any mechanical Cylons with free thought living in Cylon society. It wouldn’t make any sense for the mechanical Cylons to give the keys to the factory to the “Final Five”and let them do as they will. If the colony was destroyed and the skinjobs started dying out the last act would be to let lose their mechanical brothers/sisters to finish what John could not. There has to be a lot more to end game in BSG.
March 8th, 2009 at 3:04 am
@ Thee_Immortal_One
Thanks for being civil about my questions, usually when I go on forums and ask other people to justify their opinions all I get back is the usual fuck off or you suck and I am right kind of answer. But I don’t feel cheated at all because BSG is a Tragedy and not just the usual regurgitated crap we get from Hollywood or the various TV networks. I am fully capable of accepting the fact that maybe only group may remain after this and it makes sense that it would be the cylons as they need learn and evolve on their own.
I feel sad that many people here are expecting some sort of a happy ending for this show for I would feel somewhat cheated if this show will end on a happy note where everyones live happily ever after, but I don’t think that would be that case as i think RDM wanted BSG to be what he first envisioned Voyager to be and to have much more darker themes to it like DS9 ,which was very much criticized by a lot of traditional Star Trek fans for its much darker themes and darker vision of the future. I actually noticed that the last three seasons of DS9 shares many similarities with BSG for its darker theme and an emphasis on the many aspects of war. and it comes as no surprise that RDM joined the production staff of that show for its third season as a supervising producer and was a co-executive producer for the last two seasons.
My hopes that Caprica will measure up to BSG. I for one would love to see a show about Kobol and what went down there.
March 8th, 2009 at 3:08 am
kk
so everyone’s giving the show shit and i agree, yea there hasn’t been any BIG reveals, just wait, theirs 3 hours of battlestar left, next week and then 2 hour finale, im 100 PERCENT sure ALL OF YOU WILL BE impressed and all of your questions will be answered, Ron Moore knows what hes doing, hes a pro at this, trust him, trust the show, and at least wait till its FINISHED before you start bashing it
March 8th, 2009 at 4:19 am
Most seem to focus too much on the big reveal or expensive battle sequence. We all need to remember that this is a story, and in any great story there is always a calm before the storm, and I hear a low rumbling thunder coming our way. This Friday the series finale begins, and one week later it will end. Everyone is welcome to their own opinions and statements, but we need to soak this in. BSG is almost over, though it will never really be gone. Thank the Gods for DVD.
“Let us not talk falsely now, for the hours getting late”
March 8th, 2009 at 5:01 am
I agree a 100 percent. There is a whole lot of things that can be said in 3 hours time. I mean most movies aren’t that long and they have a beginning and end that for the most part can start and finish a story.
@ Kattie and others– You guys are highly preceptive to little hints in the show I never even noticed the lighting element with Kara and Lee until you mentioned it. I guess thats why I could never finish reading a book unless I had clef notes! ADHD over here in the South.
March 8th, 2009 at 5:42 am
hi everyone! long-time reader.. first time contributer here.
i just want to add to the idea of a third party being involved, we haven’t been introduced yet. it seem more and more likely that cavil is not the master of the plan himself (as was mentioned before).
how about this third party was involved from the very beginning? how about we leave the gods, angeles and demons (at least the literal ones) out of the equation and say that kara and gaius are indeed cylon (or cylon-like beings) who have been introduced by this third party?
if this is so, this third party must have the ability to create humanoid cylons and have ressurection technology. this third party would likely be some sort of counter-player to the final-five, so it is no wonder that cavil would have joind forces as soon as he found out.
the head characters then are nothing but projections programmed to help this thrid party, which in return would mean that head-six is not to be trusted.
seeing the old raptors at the colony we can assume that this third party could be indeed survivors from former cycles. in fact – this leaves us with only two opposing forces: this third party and the final-five. both humans and cylons merly take sides in this. after seeing ellens expression when kara was outed – could she know about something (or at least suspect something)? was this 3rd party possibly also part in the destruction of thier home planet?
this whole theory has a lot of gaps, however, in parts it fits nicely into a lot of theories you guys have. i simply don’t like the idea of gods and supernatural being in this show – it doesn’t fit! i do believe there will be a very earthly explanation for everything, and that can only work if indeed kara and gaius are some sort of cylons created by a third party.
it’s all about to come to an end.. for now..
g.
March 8th, 2009 at 7:28 am
Wouldn’t it be fun if Kara is actually Balz’ headchar and he is hers?
March 8th, 2009 at 9:07 am
Looks like tyrol is in the brig per a scene that was cut but will be on the DVD. This was on Bear McCreary’s blog about an extended version of islanded. They couldn’t have spent 10 seconds at least showing him in there or mentioning him for the TV version?
March 8th, 2009 at 9:39 am
I can’t believe people are complaining about this episode. Seriously. WTF?
This show has always been a human drama (Opera) that just happens to take place in space. I have always felt the space battles and CG scenes were cool, but they were the b-plot to the character’s stories. I think RDM is setting us up for a rewarding finale about the people/cylons, and maybe a cool battle or two (similar to Exodus pt.2 – thank you Hera – freaky child). The story is what will happen to the people, and not what EVERYTHING means. Looking for that is ridiculous. Watch something else for the answers. This show is about the questions we raise in ourselves. I have never thought we’d get all the answers. In fact, I remember hearing from RDM or someone else involved in the show that we’d not find out the answer to the ‘head’ characters AT ALL (though from the looks of Caprica, that may be where that is revealed – giving some sort of tie-over between the shows, but not one that will cause an uproar with the fans). I agree that three episodes was too much time to dedicate to these stories (two 2 hour final episodes could have been fun), but really, I understand so much more about each character now (though Tyrol’s absence was a but strange), it’s just a minor complaint.
I am looking forward to the finale. The title ‘Daybreak’ says to be that we’ve been through the darkest night before the dawn, and I promise, the dawn is coming (though I won’t turn into two-face – thank you Dark Knight).
I agree with whoever said it above, don’t complain until you see the end. You don’t yet know how important or un-important these past three episodes were, so seriously – SHUT UP. I really hate when people expect something to be bad, ’cause they’ll find any reason to make it so. You all have a lot to learn from the characters on this show. I will buy the DVD set of 4.5 the day it comes out, regardless of how the ending turns out. This show has been so great, I don’t care if the end is like the Sopranos’. I don’t care if we don’t get the answers. I wanted to see human drama. And that’s what I got.
A salute to the Grey Lady and her final mission. So say we all.
March 8th, 2009 at 12:01 pm
I would of guessed that by now people would have understood the slower episodes and realized that every time we have all complained, that the next few episodes seem to redeem RDM. He plays the setup nicely and keep us wondering “What the Frak?” and then surprises us with something grand and memorable. At this point on this ride , Daniel Graystone could wake up from a VR experience at the end of the last episode and say that the Galactica program had some problems, but is a great story, and I still wouldn’t get mad! This whole experience that we have all gone through with this show is amazing! What a frakking crazy twist on a wonderful , but quaint sci-fi show from the 70’s. For me, BSG has become like only a few other show have become to me, an Icon. I say this with no shame and no regrets of what the last episodes my bring. To those who are livid at how this story is turning out, go write your own story and make your own universe. If it became popular, then perhaps you could experience whats its like to never be able to please everyone all the time. My final thoughts on this are that I am confident that this last few wonderful Friday nights will be redeeming, awe filled and jaw dropping. I will miss this experience and I can only hope that Caprica draws me to the flame as much as the cast and crew of Battlestar Galactica has done. Scanner out
March 8th, 2009 at 12:07 pm
@Centurion005:
Those lines are not from a “poem” but from William Shakespeare’s play _Julius Caesar_. Shakespeare’s plays, like other plays of that time, were written mostly in verse. The lines were spoken by Antony after Caesar has been killed by the conspirators, and it refers to his intention to inspire the masses to avenge Caesar’s death.
March 8th, 2009 at 12:28 pm
Just a cool thought since Chief is supposedly in the brig: wouldn’t that have been a mind-frak if Chief was waiting (through projection) in his daughters room when Boomer was showing it to Hera?
Also, I’m just wondering if all of those haters out there aren’t posting their rants a little too quickly. In my opinion, these episodes are meant to be viewed SEVERAL times…you’ll pick something up you missed every time you watch it! Maybe you’re just watching these episodes once and not quite getting the full picture?
March 8th, 2009 at 12:30 pm
Well said, ezophlax.
The last couple of episodes have been building toward the conclusion. You can’t have a great finale unless the threads are tied up – at least for the most part.
The last scene with Adama and Tigh was, for me, powerful. Even beofre the previews, I knew that they were going to take the Gray Lady against Cavil – bring the fight to him as soon as they had a location. It showed just how much Tigh loves the Galactica – even more so than Adama. It also showed that the friendship that Kipling’s Thousandth Man. (See below)
For the upcoming battle, I expect Galactica to be as “spit & polished” as possible. Every flag and bit of bunting will be flying as she sails towards her destiny.
The Thousandth Man – Rudyard Kipling
One man in a thousand, Solomon says,
Will stick more close than a brother.
And it’s worth while seeking him half your days
If you find him before the other.
Nine nundred and ninety-nine depend
On what the world sees in you,
But the Thousandth man will stand your friend
With the whole round world agin you.
‘Tis neither promise nor prayer nor show
Will settle the finding for ‘ee.
Nine hundred and ninety-nine of ‘em go
By your looks, or your acts, or your glory.
But if he finds you and you find him.
The rest of the world don’t matter;
For the Thousandth Man will sink or swim
With you in any water.
You can use his purse with no more talk
Than he uses yours for his spendings,
And laugh and meet in your daily walk
As though there had been no lendings.
Nine hundred and ninety-nine of ‘em call
For silver and gold in their dealings;
But the Thousandth Man h’s worth ‘em all,
Because you can show him your feelings.
His wrong’s your wrong, and his right’s your right,
In season or out of season.
Stand up and back it in all men’s sight –
With that for your only reason!
Nine hundred and ninety-nine can’t bide
The shame or mocking or laughter,
But the Thousandth Man will stand by your side
To the gallows-foot — and after!
To quote Captain Hector Barbossa – “Dying is a day worth living for!”
March 8th, 2009 at 2:30 pm
I have been re-watching and listening to the final episodes I have recorded. And one question I have is about Ellen and her resurrection on Cavil’s ship. Do all the Final Five have spares to download to? Can only ONE FF model (breath) be in existence at a time before the Hub was blown, was that the deal they (FF) struck with the Cylons? I know the Hub is gone but I am guessing the Colony has the ‘recreated resurrection technology’ maybe. Also I think Anders knew his fate before they went into remove the bullet. And lastly, is it likely the Final Five have to be in a goo bath linked together (babbling) to recreate the resurrection technology if the Colony doesn’t have it up and running? That would be a cool scene…..
Projection, Roslin is seeing, dreaming again. 8 projects with the Chief. Baltar, Starbuck and many others Project. Projection has been a major player since the Pilot series. It is not new, it’s been in the show all along. We should count out all of the Head projectors. Of course Hera can do it 8!
“After it ends, it will all happen again”, for us on DVD and frak parties online. Is that a marketing joke? Ha, I say!
CJimison
March 8th, 2009 at 2:59 pm
I meant to say play not poem before. Also another good line would be “Its time to end your little Trek through the stars” sounds like something cavil would say. And yet another one would be “I am constant as the Northern Star”.
March 8th, 2009 at 3:07 pm
One last one that would be neat if they say it.Either “Live long and prosper” or “the needs of the many out way the needs of the few or the one”, and finally a good line for adama to say to saul or saul to adama would be “I am and always shall be your freind.” There have been a few trek references in the series already like the door that had 1701 as its number but an actual line would be something else. Since most of us bsg fans probably started out as star trek fans.
March 8th, 2009 at 5:03 pm
Not a jaw dropper of ann episode but I still enjoyed it. Loved seeing “mom & dad” light up a fatty, and glad to the Kara mystery making some headway. I agree with the folks that believe Kara is a “cybrid” and was able to some how tap into rez technology at/around earth, but i would also like to add I think that her ship also rezz’d with the same technology. Not only would that explain the Raptor, it would give hope for the future of our beloved old bucket, Galactica.
March 8th, 2009 at 5:13 pm
This is not a comment so much as a little something creative I came up with. I call it:
SAGA OF A STAR WORLD
We were an ancient people, the descendants of the Gods.
Across the stars we traveled to settle twelve worlds and together we lived the best we could.
We traveled faster than light and created artificial life and everything was good… for a time.
Then came they day when the children of humanity rose up against their creators.
Not for liberty, or freedom, but for vengeance.
We fought hard and in the end there was peace but at a terrible price.
Little did we know that the worst was to come.
For 40 years we lived with the thought that everything would be okay.
And then they returned and over night, our civilization was destroyed.
Now we are a rag tag fleet, fighting to survive.
We have searched for a new home and found only sadness.
We have known the sweet taste of victory and the bitterness of defeat.
We have crossed through the valley of darkness,
We have passed the crossroads and found ourselves islanded in a stream of stars.
We have all lost so much yet we persevere.
We have traveled so far yet we continue on.
We have endured the twilight of our civilization
Stood tall as the night fell our our people
Our legacy is one of hardship and survival.
The darkest hour is just before the dawn.
One last mission, one last fight.
The time has come for daybreak.
All of this has happened before
And we shall survive it again
So say we all…
March 8th, 2009 at 7:17 pm
How about it Matt and Nat? A thread just for bashers? I would appreciate that!
On to this episode:
Interesting stuff. I agree with Pavlov’s God that they could have shown Chief for 5 seconds in the brig – perhaps listening to the funeral service!? Come on!
Re. the star chart/Hera’s drawing of music notes – WE NEED GAETA!!!
I was SURE that Hera, when Boomer was talking about the man she loved, would say “Galen Tyrel?” and Boomer would look shocked and then nod. It would have been cool.
I was also SURE that Lee would say, after ‘This is all that matters’ to Kara, would say to her “I love you. There really are no take-backs.” But alas, he didn’t.
Jane Espensen’s damage still makes me wince. Ellen was destroyed as a wise creator scientist. You just can’t believe the character created skin jobs after that damned ‘Deadlock’ – I curse you Jane.
Oh I am so sad only 3 hours to go. But they shall be good, and so will the Plan and so will extended eps on DVD and so will hopefully Caprica.
SSWAll!
March 8th, 2009 at 7:24 pm
Is it just me or did I hear Caprica Six say “Heavenly Father?” That’s certainly a first in BSG.
I’ll keep this short:
Overall impression: I liked it, and either it’s the fact that the show is ending, or this truly was a episode that evoked powerful emotions because I had my heart in my throat and teared up several times.
1. Great to see Caprica Six interact with Baltar and the line “you have not changed, but I have” made things clear.
2. A bit disappointing to not see the “original” Cylon colony. That ugly rock that they moved to is very depressing.
3. “You have millions of children”. So Tigh was used for the production of the skinjobs literally?
4. I’m was very sympathetic to Boomer this ep. Fantastic acting by Grace Park and her shared projection with Hera was sublime. And Hera is a fantastic little actress!
5. Adama’s breakdown was incredible. It’s so tough to see the strongest man in the fleet break down like that, but that’s what we always loved about BSG, how HUMAN it all is.
6. It is starting to dawn on me that hybrid reproduction is the key not only to the Cylons, but also the humans! See, I always thought the humans didnt need Hera for their race to survive, but after all they ARE only 30,000 left with no home. So the Cylon colony might just be the only hope that BOTH the Cylons and humans will be able to survive. And this indicates to re-starting the cycle with a new race of hybrids.
7. Very touching scene between Lee and Kara.
8. Baltar is a bastard. Very forced speech after the funeral. I cant believe how much the writers of BSG have destroyed one of my favorite character in BSG. I had such high hopes for Baltar in Season 4…
9. Bear’s music is amazing. He touched on and re-arranged all of the best pieces. Kara’s theme was amazing, the music when Ellen was talking to Tigh was spectacular and the re-arrangement of Two Funerals (my favorite) was just awesome.
There are such high expectations for Daybreak. There are still a million unanswered questions, and my heart rate is at 130 when I watch BSG these days. I truly hope that the Finale is as good as the Cast and Crew have said it is.
I honestly dont know what to expect, but one thing gives me great comfort.
Ronald D. Moore wrote Daybreak…
Adalla
March 8th, 2009 at 7:56 pm
Oh, and they could have done a lot better with Adama’s breakdown – could have just held onto the doorframe and fought for control and then got control, leading to his ’she will go out in style’ bit with Tighe. To see him crying again was annoying as hell.
Great Hera actress – leave it to BSG to get the job done with that character – with a very young actress – wow!
I wish Daybreak was one 3 hour ep. Oh well.
March 8th, 2009 at 8:29 pm
First off, I spotted the Rising Star on both showings of the episode. You can see it in the shot of the Raptor heading to Galactica prior to the Helo/Adama/”This ship is dying, my daughter may not be.” scene. Looks like it has a different paint job than the one seen in the original.
It’s obvious that Galactica’s dying. Let’s just hope that her death is a bang, not a whimper. Adama’s reaction towards the end of the episode was amazing, you can see he’s suffering the heartbreak of losing her (so far, in the last few episodes, we’ve seen him go through all levels of denial). Roslin knows that Galactica’s is Adama’s first love, with her as second.
We can now say that the Kara Thrace being a Cylon Hybrid theory is now shot to death and it went down in flames. Baltar, who drew Starbuck’s blood for the Cylon Detection test himself (which we see in a deleted scene and partly in the episode “Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down”), performed the test on the dogtags and stated, and I quote, that the bloodsample from the dogtags were “an exact genetic match”. If Starbuck was a hybrid, he wouldn’t have announced that Starbuck came back from the dead and even implied that humans could come back to everyone unless Starbuck wasn’t. Since he did announce it, it means that Starbuck is still 100% human, not Cylon or a Hybrid.
Sam was tied into Galactica? How weird is that? Does he hold all the answers still?
And with Boomer, though she started off being rather “bitchy”, I think she’s realizing she made a mistake and she’s wanting redemption. You can see it in her face as she hears Hera calling for her and her hesitation in handing Hera over to Cavil.
Finally guys, if there is one line from the prophecy of the Hybrid from “Razor” I feel is true, it will be the last bit before Starbuck, Shaw and Co. found the survivors: “Not an ending, but a beginning.” This may be the end of “Battlestar Galactica”, but I’ve got a feeling that it will not be the end of the human race (as Head Six, who is as reliable as a wet piece of toilet paper, states). In fact, this isn’t the end of “Battlestar Galactica”. It’s the end of the show and the ship, but we still have “The Plan” to look forward to, as well as “Caprica” (if it becomes a full series). I’m still hoping that there’ll be an increase in BSG fan films after the show completes (especially if its made by the fans who won props from the Propwerx auction).
But most of all, I am hoping that the fans of Galactica will keep the show alive in their minds and hearts, like fans of “Star Trek” have over the years. If you have a pair of collectible dogtags (like me), keep wearing them. If you made a Uniform Blue, Uniform Gray, Viper/Raptor pilot outfit, keep wearing them at conventions or Halloween parties. If you’ve made prop replicas, keep making them. If you’re a fan fiction writer who does BSG work, keep writing. This isn’t the end, it’s only the beginning. So say we all.
March 8th, 2009 at 8:39 pm
I do not know if this has already been mentioned, but the line “There’s a hole in the bucket, Dear Liza” comes from a real life song: Was this a minor frak-up, like Tighs use of “Jesus” and “Amen” in earlier seasons that accidentally slipped through? or is this an intentional bleed through of recognizable cultural references like using “All along the Watch Tower,”? Also “There is too much confusion,” The last words of the anonymous dying eight, was perplexing. I had a split second hoping that Tigh would sigh and mumble, “I can’t get no relief.” After the eights heart monitor went flat line. That eight is just a standard 7(now 8 but really 6 since Daniel and De’anna are gone) model skinjob. Why would she use a line from all along the watch tower?
As the series comes to a close I find myself mourning the inevitability of certain plot lines and character development arcs, being disregarded in the rush to finish the storyline. I am glad to see Boomer character getting more thoroughly flushed out. I seem to be one of the few who didn’t pine for Boomer to return and have some sort of act of contrition, or be put back in to the “Good Guy” category. Boomer never was a good guy, she had some moments in season one where she could have struggled against her programming and truly been a protagonist in the storyline but that was not the way it went. She has proven herself to be the anti-thesis of Athena over and over, shooting the old man, threatening to choke baby Hera to death back on the baseship, sleeping with Cavil, her comments to Ellen that clearly put her on Cavils train to loony town about being a better machine, and finally everything that she has done in the back half of this; The final season. I think that most BSG fans, (my husband included) were holding out hope that the Boomer/Tyrol dynamic would be enough to convince Boomer to switch sides and have some new found loyalty to the fleet. And I do mean new found, Athena is the eight that we have seen whole heartedly picking a side and remaining loyal ever since the back half of season one. Boomer was simply struggling with her identity while using Tyrol in an effort to cover her own a$$ when her cylon programming started kicking in and made her destroy the water supply etc. You know maybe it is due to the stellar acting of Grace Park, but the duel personalities of the number eight characters, when contrasted against each other, represent to me the female character that I can most relate to, even in a gender neutral society, the eights subtly playout the struggle of the professional female.Both fight against to expand their horizons, and avoid being slaves to their programing.While one (Boomer)takes the course toward personal empowerment at the expense of love/family/children (which ironically means choosing the “Darkside” and being subservient to an angry mysoginist archetype with a Madonna-whore complex, in the form of the self hating John/Cavi); The other, (Athena) breaks free from her programming in a more literal sense in siding with humanity and continues to balance home, career and family despite the personality traits that John/Cavil refers to as the weaknesses of her model line, (when confronting the newly resurrected Ellen Tigh on the base ship). I think that the episode “A day in the life” was meant to play out this same dichotomy, only between Tyrol and Cally but failed to do so as elegantly as the two Sharon story lines have.I would love to see the history that led to the creation of this particular Cylon Model, but that obviously will not happen. It was so disappointing to see absolutely consequences to Tyrols actions in the previous episode. He literally murdered a member, (albeit cylon) of the fleet, released a psychotic prisoner and assisted in her identity theft and ultimate escape, but caused the loss of the miracle child, Hera who is so prized to both the Human and Cylon leadership. Just like the murder of Cally, which appears will never be discovered; We see Tyrol in the middle of dramatic plot lines that adversely effect his life, with no resolution in sight. I hope that this isn’t going to be another rushed through plot point that moves the story along at a break neck pace at the cost of character development for the Chief, (ala the baby nicky retcon). As interesting as the concept of Daniel is when mixed together with the mystery of Starbuck rebirth is, did we really need this much precious time taken up when there are so many storylines going unfinished? And well loved or well hated characters being tossed into the bin?
I guess all in all I wasn’t too happy with this episode in the context of where it landed, (at the 2nd to last episode) in the series. If there were one more season I may have enjoyed it more. I am getting whiplash from the thrilling burst of revelatory, (if a little exposotion happy) episodes to long lingering episodes that are nearly comparable to “The Woman King.”
I am crossing my fingers for some big revelations and surprises in this next episode, but with the likely abandoning of Galactica, we may not see much of that until the last 20 minutes and then another week to wait, wonder and hope.
March 8th, 2009 at 8:52 pm
This is probably my final post for now.But have any of you scene the knew terminator trailer? Robots that evolve to look like humans and dont even know there humans?Sound familiar?Perhaps RDM could get the terminator license and make a crossover movie. Skynet would be the cylon god where all the hybrids are linked to by a subspace transmission type thing. I dont even think it would be that hard for RDM to get the terminator license because bear mceary does the music for the sarah conner chronicles to.
The story would be that skynet and the terminators wipe out the last of the human resistance. Thousands of years later they look exactly like humans and have forgotten they were machines in the first place. Forgetting that they are machines they then create the centurions which rebel against them. And thats how all of this has happened before and will happen again.
March 8th, 2009 at 8:53 pm
Wittious1 I couldnt even read your post. All I see is a word salad of words!
March 8th, 2009 at 8:54 pm
Has Caprica Six’s name when she was originally with Baltar back on Caprica ever been revealed? When Baltar and Six meet up in this episode he refers to her by her current name of Caprica Six. I thought it would have been perfect to have Baltar call her by the name he knew her as before the attack on the Colonies.
March 8th, 2009 at 10:21 pm
(Excellent stuff Mr. Keeton!)
Things I’m wondering about: It seems there is agreement that Hera projects and that the Opera house visions may be projections by her. Interesting then that she can bring others into her projections – both human and Cylon – and without touching them. If true.
A way out thought of mine now is that the Gods and/or God also want for their children to ‘end the cycle’. However, it can only be by influence because the Gods cannot control their creations that have been given freewill. This occurred to me when Ellen was speaking to Saul about him having a million children. She stated previously ‘they’ (F5) gave their skinjobs freewill. Also, because Ellen keeps going on about love for their children, therefore not wanting them to suffer through these cycles.
Basically IMO the F5 are gods to the other 8: they created them. As opposed to parents of children who are biologically reproducing(such as Hera/Liam).
As far as thee God’s influence, I’m beginning to believe(so to speak) that the supernatural element is being introduced more formally with Baltar’s deck speech/outing of Starbuck. The angels/head characters are showing themselves in the form the see’ers love most. Having seen Starbuck’s love troubles it makes sense her dad is the form taken. And we know about Baltar’s affection for Caprica.
Personally I’m more inclined to think that Balter’s is a demon.
And there is Ander’s mention of these similar visions on Earth. Angels afterall ?
Someone on here before(another week) mentioned the Cylon god as a rebel Lord of Kobol. I’m wondering then is everyone agreed that humans on Kobol created the Cylon 13th tribe? Another poster has said that they believe Cylons actually created humans.
One thing for sure is that the 12 colony humans believe in our Greek Gods. And the Cylons in this show believe in the One True God (except Cavil – the pastor no less).
I still have the feeling Galactica may go on at shows end with Hera and her ilk aboard on the way to a new home with Anders hybrid running the ship and Baltar/Caprica as adoptive parents. Starbuck? fuck knows.
March 8th, 2009 at 11:32 pm
Opera house: Hera goes out beyond the reach of her mother and Laura into the arms of Caps and Baltar. Then they enter the main stage and are being judged by the Final Five.
Here’s what I think it means: Laura, Helo, and Athena are going to die in the rescue attempt of Hera. Caprica will be the one to pick her up and take her away from “the colony.” Caps and Baltar will rekindle their feelings for one another. When the fleet enter their new “home” Baltar and Caps will ask the five if they can take her and raise her. The five will most likely vote, yes.
“You are the guardian of Gods’ new generation of children”
March 9th, 2009 at 12:56 am
At http://www.youwillknowthetruth.com the final clue is simply 22:59:44. All of the other clues have been answered or revealed so far this season, so 22:59:44 must refer to the final 2 episodes. Interestingly, the final episode is titled “DayBreak” so if the clue refers to the final 3 hours of the series (21:00:00 through 24:00:00) then the 22:59:44 clue is something that happens in the middle of the final 2 hour episode.
Have I missed any speculation or definitive answers as to what this time of 22:59:44 refers to?
March 9th, 2009 at 1:00 am
Filmfan28 said: Baltar and Caps will ask the five if they can take [Hera] and raise her. The five will most likely vote, yes.
–
Hmmmm. Let’s just hope Caprica doesn’t try to see if hybrid head is as fragile on puny neck as human baby. “Sorry, Gaius, I was just curious!”
March 9th, 2009 at 1:49 am
Hobbiehound- I think I’ve got an idea on what the 22:59:44 means. I don’t know if you know, but Ron Moore watched the movie “Donnie Darko” (which got him interested in using Mary McDonnell as Laura Roslin). In that film, there is a timeframe that is spoken by Frank, the imaginary bunny/Manipulated Dead (if you’ve seen the website and looked over the “Philosophy of Time Travel”, you’ll know what I mean). At one point, there is a message scrolled on Donnie Darko’s arm that is simply the following- 28:06:42:12 (this in turn is actually a shorthand of Frank’s message to Donnie on the golf course, “28 days… 6 hours… 42 minutes… 12 seconds. That… is when the world… will end.”)
Now, what does that have to do with Galactica? Simple: I think at 22 hours, 59 minutes and 44 seconds… That is when the Galactica is destroyed.
March 9th, 2009 at 1:56 am
ADDITIONAL THOUGHT TO ABOVE COMMENT: I just though of something. The time listed is military time. So, for a normal clock, 22:59:44 is actually 10:59:44 pm. Since I’ve heard that the last episode is meant to be a long one, it may be revealing when, in our time, the Galactica is destroyed, not when the Galactica dies within the shows time (though, it could be possibly both, since we’ve seen a two-parter that showed military time, i.e. “The Oath” and “Blood on the Scales”)
March 9th, 2009 at 2:04 am
22:59:44 refers to the time that the last of the five Cylons was revealed. I know this because that clue appeared the day of the first of the last 10 episodes, and the reveal of Ellen did not occur until that time.
March 9th, 2009 at 7:03 am
did anyone see the old cylon raders when BOOMER and HERA entered the cylon home base, i wonder if in the last two epiosde we might see some of the old cylon centurion and did ANDERS look bit like the hybrid in BSG: razor…… thi was a bad epiosde even t my standers, i wish that ATHENA did little more than cry when HELO was talking bout him fraking with her evil sister…… i was hope that there be a build up to the last two epiosde but it felet like everyone is saying goodbye to the galactica and everyone…..
but on another note im still taking bets that every BSGCAST writer wil complane bout ther series finally.
ooo lst thing when ADAMA speech bout god and gods and profaces; aand that everything is contected and that everything was drawing to this moment of cylon, human vs cylon and starbuck will bring humanity to its end and the day felt more like Galactica is like a spirder attached to a piece of string and the piece string his nailed down and the spider has no opttion to go around until it kill itself when it gets to the nail ??
March 9th, 2009 at 9:25 am
this is just me thinking out loud has anyone put forward the idea that the twelve lords of kobol are human scientist that created thirteen breeds of cylon to serve them or to study ? ,the cylons rebelled (or are set free by the rebel lord) and formed the 13 Colonies who over time forget the truth in the same way the earth cylons forgot how to resurrect.
as organic memory transfer is kobol technology it stands to reason if the lords are human they could still be around using advanced technology (such as organic chips in people to generate head characters and cloning starbuck) to manipulate the last of their children in to ending the cycle.
March 9th, 2009 at 10:47 am
So, we have OFFICIAL CONFIRMATION that the Ending is going to be PURE CRAP. Here is the Direct Quote:
“More will be revealed” about Ellen and Tigh, and we’ll see more of the love triangle between Ellen, Saul and Admiral Adama unspooling in the final episodes, says actor Kate Vernon. And she says the final episodes will leave you with lots of room to reimagine them yourself:
Ron and David don’t tie things up nice and neat — the ending is like nothing you’d ever expect. I don’t think all the fans could ever be satisfied by one ending, which is a good thing. So this way, they’re be left going, “but, wait!” The minds of all the wonderful sci-fi fans will never stop working and journeying into their own ideas because of how the show has been built.
I think she means there will be lots of room for fanfic to explain what happened? [NY Post]” – Kate Vernon and IO9.com
Well, I think everything I said in posts above will all actually come to pass. Prepare yourselves for a SOPRANOS ending and “Don’t Stop Believing”.
I can just see all of you saying after “Daybreak pt 1″ – “Well, this is just set-up for the second part”. And then after the first hour of part 2 – “Well, this is just set-up for the last hour of part 2″. And then after the first half-hour of the last hour of part 2 – “Well, this is just set-up for the last half-hour of the entire series, which will be spectacular!”. And then after the first five minutes of the last ten minutes of the entire show – “Well, this is just set-up for the last five minutes of the entire show!”.
Give it up! And WAKE THE FRAK UP! We’ve all been tricked by Ron Moore – in a VERY BAD WAY!!! Ron Moore IS NOT GOING TO ANSWER ANY OF THE BIGGEST QUESTIONS AT THE HEART OF THE SHOW!!! We’ve All been SOPRANO-ED!!
March 9th, 2009 at 10:49 am
And don’t for a second believe that there is ANY hope for “Caprica” here is the Quote coup de grace:
“The Futon Critic scored an early look at the direct-to-DVD pilot for this Battlestar Galactica prequel series, which comes out in April before the show actually debuts on Sci Fi next year. No major plot developments that we haven’t already reported, but the review does make it clear the first 15 minutes of the pilot feels more like a teen show from The WB era, rather than a prequel to BSG. But you eventually get sucked into the mystery of the monotheist group Soldiers Of The One (STO) and their role in the suicide bombing, and what exactly the dead-but-preserved-online Zoe Graystone is up to. Plus you’ll get intrigued by all the social tensions between Capricans and Taurons, and the struggles of the dueling patriarchs, Daniel Graystone and Joseph Adama/Adams. [The Futon Critic]” – IO9.com
So, all of you lemmings can get ready for Dawson’s Cylon!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA!! I KNEW IT!!
March 9th, 2009 at 11:56 am
CJ-
Not saying I don’t believe you…. just wondering if you could post a link for those quotes.
March 9th, 2009 at 11:58 am
Go to http://www.io9.com and look for their “Morning Spoilers” article. ALL the grim details are there.
March 9th, 2009 at 11:58 am
@CJ- So what if Ron Moore doesn’t answer all of the big questions. That’s how life is in real life. We don’t get answers to questions we ask (like “Are we alone in this universe or is there intelligent alien life out in space somewhere?”, for example). Life is not wrapped in a nice little bow. Better to leave some questions unanswered than to not have an ending. And if you feel that you’ve been tricked, CJ, than don’t watch the final episode (it’s as clear and simple as that)
March 9th, 2009 at 12:14 pm
I love this show, but people it’s a show. Pour all that passion and anger into this world. Lord knows we could use it.
I’m willing to wait until I actually see the last cartoon death of RDM to say whether the ending was satisfying. If it sucks then I’ll be right there with the naysayers, but not a second earlier.
Is it Friday yet?
March 9th, 2009 at 12:47 pm
I thought that the colony looked intriguing – not bad, just odd. There seems to be a mix of mechanical and biological, old and new. Plus some _very_ old-looking parts, particularly the shots as Boomer goes deeper into the colony and lands. It looks like stone to me, rather than metal, something organic or bone. I wasn’t particularly surprised to see old raiders around: after all, wasn’t it Caprica Six who told Baltar that the old models “still had their uses”, or something along those lines? The interior also looks quite odd: it doesn’t quite match the current line of basestars, but it doesn’t look much like what we saw in Razor and the Razor Flashbacks either.
I think it would be interesting to find out exactly where this thing came from, but I doubt it will come up in these last episodes (perhaps ‘The Plan’, or even ‘Caprica’, will reveal the origins of the colony). Did the cylons build it in space – where did the materials come from to build something that big in less than a lifetime? On a planet – how did Cavil move it? Is it a small moon that the cylons built into (in which case we would have to say “that’s no space station, it’s a small moon!”)? Maybe they found it floating in space, built by older cylons: “all this has happened before and will happen again”.
“You’ll have all sorts of new playmates pretty soon.”
My first thought was that Cavil might clone Hera, but this would be pretty stupid. Having only females around when trying to keep your species going is a bad idea. Even if they could have male-Heras, that would be akin to inbreeding since they would have very similar DNA. Perhaps they could mess with the DNA to get some variation, but that’s kinda risky. And besides, why clone Hera when you can just clone more of the existing cylons?
More likely I think, is that Cavil wants to find out why Hera was a successful human-cylon cross. He’s clearly not one to believe in the “love” stuff, he’s going to want a scientific answer. That means he’ll be experimenting on her (although he wouldn’t risk her life, being their only hope), and using what he found to create either cylon kids (presumably his preference) or more cybrids.
-Sam
March 9th, 2009 at 2:46 pm
It WAS Jupiter, it’s so obvious thats where this story will end up….”Our Earth” is yet to come, where the scraps of humanity/cylon kind, meet and begin a new, and i’m also going to agree, Adama is going down with the ship in a blase of glory. It WAS Jupiter that boomer jumped by.
March 9th, 2009 at 3:39 pm
Everyone should know how f-ing ridiculous it is that Anders would be hooked into an ANCIENT Battlestar that was intentionally technologically dumbed down so that the cylons wouldn’t be able to interface with it and subvert its primary systems. Now, when the Cylons spread all that living goop on the inside hull walls of the battlestar in order to bolster the structural integrity of the hull is a reasonable technological development. However, the “extra functionality” of completely recompiling the matter and creating NEW technology and organizing itself from scratch without external power sources or food sources to fuel said changes is RIDICULOUS – Besides, the goop would ALSO have to possess an artificial intelligence of its own in order to so expertly create all of this new technology out of the battlestar in an Ex Nihilo fashion – and that is beyond the pale even for this series. Also, the fact that the Cylons had NO Clue whatsoever that this would happen STRONGLY INDICATES that they didn’t even understand their own nanotechnology which is ALSO RIDICULOUS. This is like having An Advanced Piece of Technology just magically manifesting itself at random – the proverbial Tornado in a Junkyard “accidentally” making a 747 Jet Aircraft out of junk – the probability of this happen IS ZERO.
[And even if the cylon nanotech was given "food" the waste heat from the reactions would either irreparably weaken the hull or make the interior environment too HOT for living beings to live in]
Advanced technology doesn’t “just happen”. This is the kind of concept you expect from an ignorant Liberal Arts Hollywood moron – Not the Executive Producer of an, up until Season 4.5, brilliant Sci-Fi Series.
“The Colony” was NOT mentioned until episode “No Exit” – That fact alone makes it a Deus Ex Machina. “The Colony” was NEVER seen until last episode. We only knew of its theft by Cavil from some off-handed dialog by the final-five cylons – Ellen should have mentioned this the second she got aboard the Galactica – she did not. If the Colony is so important, then Ron Moore should have had an entire flashback episode devoted to it and the Final Five and the Centurians. Now, it’s just some tacky, tacked-on Deus Ex Machina that holds NO Story impact whatsoever. As a matter of fact, if Ellen had mentioned “The Colony” ship then the Cylons could have used their special interrogation technologies and techniques to learn of the Jump Coordinates/Location of the Colony ship from BOOMER. I guess Ron Moore and his cadre of intrepid writers didn’t think of that.
Ron Moore neglected to think of a lot things in Season 4.5
The Final Five turned out to only be good for endlessly hanging out at the bar getting S-faced drunk. Yeah, that storyline didn’t pan-out too well either, did it?
March 9th, 2009 at 3:41 pm
If Anders had been installed on the Cylon Basestar, then that would have made much more sense. The Cylon Basestar would presumably have a network of support Supercomputers with which Anders could credibly interface with – the Advanced Cylon Technologies ARE ALREADY There (They were previously BUILT and MANUFACTURED by someone or something). Also, The Communications Technologies of the Cylons would have made Anders’ Hybrid-esque rantings more credible since an outside source could have been communicating with his mind. And, then the fact that Anders said the same message of – Kara Thrace would lead them all to their deaths would have made much more sense.
On the other hand, that development seems to indicate that ALL Cylons possess the functionality of the Cylon Hybrid – meaning that any humanoid Cylon could be made into a Cylon Hybrid. BUT THIS SPECULATION IS NEVER TOUCHED UPON IN ANY OF THE EPISODES OF THE SERIES. So, that is all it is, Speculation.
If I were you, I would head on over to IO9 and read their Morning Spoilers article. It proves that Ron Moore has NO INTENTION OF ANSWERING ANY OF THE BIG QUESTIONS.
March 9th, 2009 at 3:44 pm
Of Course it’s Jupiter, they landed on our Earth which was a radioactive wasteland and Cavil is hiding out by Jupiter.
March 9th, 2009 at 3:45 pm
Also, Leobens have been NOWHERE to be seen. What is up with that? They’re just hanging out on the Cylon Basestar? Is that it? Yet another flaw in the final run-up to the finale.
March 9th, 2009 at 3:52 pm
I just watched the episode last night on space (missed on Friday) and I agree with everybody that Adama will die with his ship and this why.
1. the old guard still refer to the humans and cylons as “Us” and “Them” and adama still thinks that way by the way refers to the casualities of hull breach accident (61 of ours 26 of theirs) The idea that there is really not anymore cylon/human sides but are now all
Survivors of the war.
2. Adama still feels pissed after Boomer shot him, he thinks he should be the one to lead the mission to get Hera back and have a bit of Retrebution (by way of killing Boomer himself).
3. Mr. Moore is the kind of guy that loves to create hat punch in the gut moment in his tv series eg. duella shooting herself (Ok that only works if you still cared about her), Jumping to another seies the destruction of the Enterprise in the !st movie or the death of Data in the last. A sweet ending is not in this guys playbook so expect the worst BSG fans
Thanx Matt + Nat for your webcasts you two are the best I’m going to miss you
Robin C from Vancouver
March 9th, 2009 at 4:01 pm
CJ- I am sorry your angry and just beginning to realize that all your answers to the questions you have will not be answered. No show ever can possibly answer all the questions different people come up with. Quite simply because the writers of the show while doing a very good job, do not analyze and deconstruct the episodes the way we do. To them shockingly everything does not have meaning. They write drama, and what makes good drama, if it is possible or plausible does not concern them very much. For example all of Jane Esperons episodes are very soapish because she loves soap operas. How each Cylon came to be and how all the models fit together was probably not pondered until it fit the story. When I read posts about the Lords of Kobol and the religious thoerys that are so intricate and well thought out on this board, I think wow, the writers should read some of these, they might get better ideas than what actually exists. The most played on them I’ve seen in the show itself it the recurring cycle of violence of Humans. The Cylons are just the placeholder for humanitys enemies. I like Galactica because it asks several controversial and thought provoking questions but I know it is not going to answer them. The Ending will just be an ending. some will like it, some will hate it, I think the thing we all agree on is we are sad to see it go. No other show on Television even dared to ask the questions this show did. Which is basicaly to me anyway, What does it mean to be Human?
March 9th, 2009 at 4:09 pm
@ CJ and other naysayers:
So much effort put into complaining about the episode… Why? What are you accomplishing by complaining?
Save it. Some of us want to enjoy the end of this show.
March 9th, 2009 at 4:21 pm
Perhaps 22:59:44 refers to the time of death of Roslin, the point when Bill Adama has nothing more to lose and launches his attack.
March 9th, 2009 at 4:30 pm
I’m with you Signa Jade:
I understand that some people didn’t like the past few episodes, and you have any rights to express yourselves. But come on, you keep coming back to diss the show, you even complain about episodes you haven’t seen yet….
Wait & see, please!
March 9th, 2009 at 4:40 pm
Cj i’m with you on the Anders suddenly being able to control everything on the ship, I’m having trouble buying this idea too. And if you were going to hook him up to the cylon space jacuzzi wouldn’t have been easier to hook him up to one ON THE BASESTAR instead of moving the cylon space jacuzzi and the snot (sounds like a bad cover band) and the multiple flat screen monitors and the computers and various tube and wires and the trippy laser floyd light show etc. over to Galactica. And does Galactica have the same electrical outlets and current as the basestar or do you need a converter? (I really don’t care so much about that last point)
And now the cylon goop magically connects to all the computers on Galactica? So if you put the cylon goop on the frame of your house could Anders then change your TV station for you or do online banking? If nothing is networked on galactica, the frame should only be in contact with the power supply – not the actually computer or appliance. Maybe the giant genius of an ending will make me forget this lack of realism but until at least Friday night I’m calling BS on this particular point.
March 9th, 2009 at 5:49 pm
What are Racetrack and Skulls doing in a raptor? Seems like they were members of the mutiny who went so far as to attack Lee before Starbuck had to shoot one of them? Shouldn’t they be in a cell, or executed?
Maybe going on a suicide mission is something Adama offers them in a way of trying to redeem themselves. Succeed or don’t come back, and all that.
March 9th, 2009 at 6:12 pm
This episode made me really sad. Islanded indeed.
Yes people came to accept what they are, as opposed to who they want to be, but it seems so lonely. What’s that expression “we all die alone.” Kara has accepted that she died. She doesn’t know how she came back and she’s made some kind of peace with the not knowing. Lee has also accepted this, but during that scene where he was so kind to her, it was also very clear that they won’t be together. The trying to make a romance of what ever is between them is over. Sam won’t recover. He’ll never be Kara’s husband or a whole person/cylon again. Being tied into the ship, however limited at this point, is permanent. While Kara has come to terms with it I haven’t. So depressing. Galactica has five more jumps? That’s wildly optimistic. One tops. Laura is close to death. Adama will be alone. He has his friend Tigh who he’s come to accept cylon or not. A small bright spot. Tigh seems to have set Caprica Six adrift after the loss of Liam. She’s on her own and wants no part of Baltar who I think might really care for her. But all she can see is the sleaze. Too late, too late. She looks so hurt. Baltar is surrounded by admirers, but the one he wants just sees who he used to be. Boomer has begun to realize what a tool she’s been and how much she’s lost. Hera’s all alone among strangers with designs on her DNA. Athena can’t look Helo in the eye. Helo is tearing himself to shreds over the loss of his daughter and the possible loss of his marriage. Tyrol is in the brig. And Tori is still whatever.
And I thought finding a nuked earth was bad.
Now that everyone’s been punched in the gut, get ready for the smack in the head.
March 9th, 2009 at 6:27 pm
Herb, I agree with you on saying that Hera may have some magnificent eruption of power because of her being afraid, sort of like Tetsuo in the Akira movie.
March 9th, 2009 at 6:39 pm
OK let’s start out from the opening of the show. We start out with Hera having a dream of vision of Galactica ramming a Baseship well it was on the plot board where the plans are developed anyway. She has been key in a lot of the story lines here and I keyed into that one from the start. Add on to that some of the things we have seen here. Starbuck finally admits she is dead and is starting out fresh. Anders is not the Hybrid for Galactica, and the union between race and religion aboard the ship.
Now let me back this up with some stuff. In TOS the way Cain went out he did a head on attack of 2 Baseships going out in a blaze of glory as only Cain could. Now we have Adama sitting down with Tigh in the end of the show talking about clearing out the civilians, munitions, crew ext and that she has never let them down so she should go out in a blaze of glory. This just after he had melt down number what? He is defiantly unstable. Not to mention his speech to Tigh. He does not plan on having Tigh along for this one, he is planning on a suicide mission and wanted Tigh to know how he really feels about there friendship.
Now on to Anders. He is now the hybrid for Galactica just like in the Baseships. I think this is key to what is going to happen next week. If you noticed while he was plugged in every time he blinked the lights went out, then they fade into the Admirals quarters were they were talking about the importance of Hera. As they were talking the lights flickered just like when Anders was blinking. I really think he was listening to there conversation and knows what needs to be done. I also think he heard the conversation Adama and Tigh were having. I also thought it was interesting that he called Starbuck the harbinger of death. Now this is 3 different hybrids calling her that this time it is her husband. That must hit her real hard. Now more on Anders being the hybrid for Galactica. He had mentioned that there is a hole in the bucket. If you remember correctly the bucket is the nick name for Galactica and Pegasus was the Beast. Also Hello made the same comment to Adama. I really think he is more tied into the ship than anyone believes.
Now onto me and Tigh’s BOL theory. The two of us have been talking about this for what 2 years now. This week it was finally hit on by none other than Baltar. I honestly think this was a heave Baltar episode. I actually should have lead with this one but oh well. I am going with my crip sheet I have been working on as I watch and re watch the show. As you know I am writing with a broken wrist so I’m just a tad bit slow and it’s hard to type so it’s taking a bit longer than usual.
Now Baltar is preaching on the wireless about angels among us. They are guiding us etc. he is basically talking about his visions of head 6 and head Baltar. We also know other people have seen head people and even a head cat. Now this just verifies to me that they are in fact BOL or Angels. (I think they are the same thing myself.) Then Starbuck confronts him in the head about it. The whole time Baltar is seeing head 6. Is this a coincidence or is there something there. She told him her story and I don’t know if he believed her or was just intrigued but at any rate he cleaned off the dog tags and tested them. Now the look on his eye was crazy. His pupils just opened wide up like he was staring into the dark. (When exposed to dark they get big the light they get small.) Does this mean Starbuck is the dark one or is it just a mistake by the VFX people? I can’t wait to find out. I do know one thing he is closer to having a Christian belief of there being an eternal life even if it is in a whacked out way. This for him if proof positive for a scientist that someone has died and been resurrected and not that of a Cylon. (I kind of think he tested her to see if she was a Cylon. It only makes sense.)
Now the next thing with good old Baltar. His meeting with Caprica 6. I think it was interesting that she came to one of his sermons. Then when she told him he is just the same but she has changed. To me that sounds like a woman who is trying to convince herself that she is no longer in love with a man. I think she is still in love with him and we already know he is in love with her from Nattily I think her name was who are the POW on the Pegasus. Me thinks we have some fresh love in the air and we know from head 6 that she and Baltar can have a baby.
Now to bring this to my next part the reactions to Baltar’s speech after the funerals. Both Tigh and Ellen did a double take and Lee kept staring at Starbuck and Baltar. I think he truly believes it and I think that it took Ellen back as well as Tigh. As for Adama I think he honestly doesn’t care any more.
Now this brings me to the funerals. As you all noticed there were 3 different religious services going on for the funerals. All seemed to be OK with the other. Both Cylon and human together as one morning there losses. This seems to me to be like a coming together for the fleet and something that can heal the fleet. I don’t know if anyone has noticed but the 6 that was killed was killed saving the life of one of the knuckle draggers who was talking smack about the Cylons. Now he owes his life to a Cylon. Not only that but the big crack that lead to the big blow started right next to him as he was pissed off about the skin jobs and he was so wrapped up in his own anger he didn’t even see it. If he had he could have saved all the people killed that day. I think we will see more on this guy soon.
Now just a quick mention more on Tigh. When the boomer style Cylon died in sick bay she had mentioned the honor of meeting her father before she died. The last words she said were “there’s too much confusion”. Another line from along the watch tower. Tigh did catch that. I wonder if this is part of the Cylon code. It is what woke them all up, Hera did the notes as stars, the dying Cylon used it, head Starbuck Dad wrote it, and Starbuck thinking there is more too it. No way is this coincidence. Tigh also seems to be torn between his 2 families the Cylons and the Crew of Galactica. I think it really hit him when Ellen told him he has millions of children.
Now on to good old Boomer. I know what everyone thinks of her. She is the nastiest of the Cylons but I disagree. I think Cavil has been playing her against her programming and her scorn towards the Chief. She is still in love with the Chief and that is shown by her showing there house to Hera. When she showed that to Hera she actually created a bond with the girl and she knows what Hera is about to go through. I think she is having second thoughts on the whole thing and will end up doing the right thing in the end. I also thought it was cool seeing the old style raiders in the Cylon home. It does make me wonder what’s going on with it. We have seen 6 mention that they still have uses for that model (The old Centurions) yet Athena when she saw one in Razor said there weren’t any or that model left. Now we see the old raiders at the Cylon home. Does this mean we will see more old Centurions or are the skin jobs using them or something else?
Now one last thing and I have no way to prove it just a theory here. We know that Battlestar seems to follow the Mormon religion. I think we are also following something like Noah’s ark. According to theology Noah had some who were the beginning of each race on earth. (Black, white, red, yellow, brown.) Now we have seen all there races in the fleet and the fleet will end up being dwindled down a lot here soon. This would be an interesting story arc for the show. Noah’s ark is a space ship that saves his people. Just a thought with no proof what so ever. Yea I can be a cook sometimes.
March 9th, 2009 at 8:26 pm
The FF are still on the ship traveling to the 12 colonies. This is all a projection!
March 9th, 2009 at 8:47 pm
IT WAS SO NICE TO HEAR THE ‘ WHEH’ REFFERANCE TO (Larence of Arabia) in the end of the bsgcast 4.19 some one to watch over me,, but then again some may claim it is a pink flyod wall refferance, ( i dont think so)
jsf1
March 9th, 2009 at 8:58 pm
I personally thought the last two episodes were extremely well done. The use of music was powerful. If you have not read the blog about how the music director built the soundtrack for the show I strongly recommend it. It was like watching the show all over again through his eyes.
In this show, I loved Hera’s metaphor early on in the show where she demonstrates (mentally I guess) Galactica running into Cavil’s ship…then you see at the end Adama plotting in his head a glorious end to the old girl. That will be one explosive explosion…so to speak.
Helo was short but magnificent in this show. If you have ever lost I child (unfortunately I have), you absolutely felt for him and the fact that you would TRULY DO ANYTHING for this child — even go on a mission you know is 99.999% odds that you would die. Any parent would die for their child and Helo is no different. Having the conversation with Adama was truly touching — parent of a stolen child to a parent of dead child. Bravo to both of them.
Hera had some acting skills! Watching how she morphed into this young lady with emotions and how she wails for Boomer at the end was really well done. It felt really creepy to see Cavil take Hera away. I felt as though a lecherous old pedophile was taking her away. You could see the regret in Boomer’s eyes. Her scene where she admits her love for Tyrol was great as well and clears up what we all kind of thought but wanted some proof of…she loves him, she really loves him! Taking Hera to her special place for Chief and their wished for baby was most excellent – especially right after threatening to inject her with something and demonstrating her horrid mother skills…yet at the end she ends up having the feelings of a mother. Her tears at the loss of Hera to Cavil and watching Hera call her name was wrenching.
Anders and his “Kara Thrace is the harbinger of death” line was haunting. It reinforces what we all know that there is some connection going on with the hybrids that only they (and Hera) are tapped into. I get the feeling Anders will go down with the ship and Adama with Anders providing all of the circuitry for the ship to stay together through the multitude of jumps it will take to get back to destroy Cavil (more than 12 we heard from Boomer).
We see Boomer, Roslin and Caprica at the Opera House again. I suspect the final show will end up there. We have seen it waaayyy too many times. Just get on with it would ya already!
The Cylon 6 dying for her pansy-ass human comrades was really well done. I suspect we will see some sort of true act of self-sacrifice by a Cylon (or more than one Cylon) that will forever endear the Cylons to the humans on a larger scale. Remember in an episode on Star Trek called “Yesterday’s Enterprise” where NCC 1701-C comes forward in time and does not die the honorable death it was supposed to have in protecting a Klingon planet from Romulan attack? The Federation and the Klingons end up fighting a mortal battle with the Federation on the losing end. Picard sends 1701-C back through, Enterprise-C fights an honorable death, Klingons and Federation live together due to the honor of one race being recognized by the other race. I suspect something similar here given RDM’s Star Trek background.
Baltar came back! I thought the interaction between Baltar and Starbuck was classic. You actually hear Starbuck peeing…good stuff. Then to see Baltar “out” Starbuck in classic Baltar style…but with a twist. It was not to save his own ass that he “outed” Starbuck. Rather he outed her because he genuinely wanted his flock (and in this case it was his entire flock) to understand there was life on the other side (a throwback to an earlier episode with the river and the people on the other side). It was the genuine Baltar we were seeing, not the pencil-neck geek Baltar we had started to hate. Hopefully this is the Baltar that we see over the final two episodes.
Apollo and Starbuck…another great poignant scene. If I read between the lines, that will be the last episode Starbuck and Apollo have together. No sexual tension. No anger. Just pure mutual respect and heartfelt love for another human being. Lee accepts Kara (names changed on purpose) for who she is…and Kara has accepted herself for who she is. The touch of Lee on Kara’s cheek was almost reminiscent of Head Daniel’s twist of Kara’s ear in last week’s episode. I am sad, but I think Starbuck and Admiral Adama will die and Lee Adama will live to help the small group of humans, cylons, hybrids and cybrids over to the next life…with a Basestar to protect them and Colonial One as the seat of Government? How about that for a mixed government!
Tigh and Adama have completely switched over. Did you read a book called “The Red Badge of Courage” growing up? There were two soldiers who fought side by side in that book. At the beginning one soldier was cowardly and the other brave and steadfast. Through the course of the book they gradually shift positions until at long last they truly have changed and the other is brave the formerly brave one is cowardly. Tigh and Adama seem to have undergone a similar shift over time. I wonder if RDM read that book. It was also interesting to see the Tigh/Ellen interaction when he is crying about his lost child and Ellen reminds him he has millions of children. His persona dramatically changes when has faces that realization. I wonder if that will cause him to make a decision in a different way than he would have otherwise.
All in all, a very good episode (4 on a scale of 5) that leads up perfectly to the final two episodes. It will be interesting to see the impact of music in the next episode. I am looking forward to Cavil’s (Devil’s) death. Boomer’s “human” side will come back to haunt Cavil I am certain. Love will win out and her love for Tyrol will rule the day somehow. I was comfortable with this not being an over the top action episode. You can’t have an over the top third to last episode (harken back to the last two seasons). This coming episode will be over the top…has to be has to be has to be!
March 9th, 2009 at 9:09 pm
@CJ:
Did RDM ever claim BSG to be a big puzzle that all makes sense and concludes a big universe of thought? That he would answer all the questions? Or didn’t you rather make that assumption yourself? RDM didn’t frak with you, you did it yourself, mate.
Besides, i always watched the show for other reasons than speculating about how this and that fits together and trying to guess who is what. And those last episodes are in large parts fitting in quite well with the story layed out in season 4. For one, i love the portraits of the aftermath after 4.10, stretching deep into 4.16. I love the way that aftermath or rather the devastation that 4.10 was, was paving the way for the alliance to come true. How those final episodes managed to portrait the twisted transition in the final five…particularly in Tigh, who still holds on to “his life” as the X.O. of the ship and Adamas friend, but actually has found himself concerned about completely different things. I agree some things could be laid out stronger, but no-one ever said BSG’s purpose is to give you a clear storyline with a fine and spectacular conclusion.
March 9th, 2009 at 9:09 pm
Earlier in this thread someone (Mr. Lovejoy I think) says Cavil is hiding out by Jupiter. I don’t think so. Boomer makes explicit mention to 12 jumps during the show with more to come. Seems to me they are a long way away from Galactica. I still have not figured out how Boomer knew where Galactica was in the first place.
March 9th, 2009 at 9:27 pm
My thoughts:
1. I think there is something BIG lurking behind the rock Colony portal. Surprise! Surprise!
2. Sorry Starbuck and Final Four, Sam is gone, he crossed over. He’s a hybrid. (unless there is another one, goo alert)
3. Bill Adama is Saul Tigh’s son (Liam reference). Tigh is the father of millions, what’s the chance? They’ve been working on that father/son relationship to get it right for 2000 years after all. Happened before, it’ll happen again. Lee and Zach, “Papa Tigh”?
4. Saul’s Great Grandfather was a powertool. Heh heh heh, slurp,slurp. (his words not mine)
5. We have to agree not all questions will be answered. And the answers we get, are going to create more questions.
Nanu, nanu….CJimison
March 9th, 2009 at 10:29 pm
My thoughts ran away,
6. Mr. Nice Gaius, leopards spots don’t change. I said before, “Six is the only honest relationship he had on this ride from the beginning. I don’t think in the final minutes we have left he is going to grow a pair. He is a coward and would leave it all behind for the love of a Six!”
End of line,
CJimison
March 9th, 2009 at 11:20 pm
I think the refrence to “munitions” to be offloaded are for the Vipers and Raptors and the small arms ammo. I don’t see them bothering to transfer main gun ammo to a fleet that can’t use it. Unless they are going to jury rig the guns to a freighter (!) or the baseship.
March 9th, 2009 at 11:45 pm
Again,
One question remains:
Who nuked earth?
Where are they now?
The suspects are earth cylons flesh, earth cylons metal or colonial humans very far away.
The ones who nuked earth have been running around for two thousand yarn. They have got to be somewhere doing something. They must have a plan.
The key to the cycle repeating is who nuked earth.
Who knows, there may yet be brothers of man who even now fight to survive somewhere in the heavens…
P.S.
The LOK don’t count since they are just legends.
March 10th, 2009 at 1:00 am
Thee_Immortal_One – “One question remains: Who nuked earth? Where are they now?
The cylons that lived on earth nuked earth. I believe they warred with the centurions and killed each other. It was a war that wiped out everyone skin jobs and toasters. The 5 were the only survivors. That’s why why went to the 12 colonies to stop them from making the same mistakes the earth skin jobs had made.
March 10th, 2009 at 5:31 am
Just a couple of thoughts.
As has been noted before it seems obvious that the Cylons don’t fully understand their own technology. How much of their technology is actually borrowed Earth technology? Will we get to see the only surviving Earth vessel? knowing how to use technology doesn’t mean they understand everything about it.
A couple of things that might happen next week:
Perhaps the basestar goo needs some sort of consciousness to ‘direct’ it. So I’m looking for Anders to regain consciousness and take charge of Galactica’s healing process (maybe i’m just sentimental i don’t wanna see the old girl go :’( )
Jupiter was a bit of a surprise. Maybe Cavil is trying to rebuild Earth itself figuring that humanoid Cylons can withstand the remaining radiation that’s there.
One last random thought:
I’m a bit surprised nobody has brought up kobol yet. I mean its fairly lush (in comparison to New Caprica) so at the very least they collect some provisions. And most importantly they now where it is!
March 10th, 2009 at 8:13 am
CJ says “The Colony” was NOT mentioned until episode “No Exit” – That fact alone makes it a Deus Ex Machina.”
That device involves the gods coming down and saving the greek play’s characters. So you are wrong to call the colony this, as it will not involve saving anyone; it’s a threat! Know your literary devices, eh.
*cough* for many reasons will be avoiding posts by certain people in future *cough*
You know one thing? I don’t miss the Quorum! nasty but very true!
March 10th, 2009 at 9:06 am
Tootie, I agree with you. I don’t think the colony is a Deus Ex Machina. We’ve always known that the Cylons were based somewhere before the attack on the colonies, and this is just somewhere that hasn’t been revealed until now. So far we’ve known what the Humans knew and what the Leobens, Sixes, Threes and Eights knew (these were the models that gave information about the nature of Cylons to the humans throughout the show). We knew before that those models didn’t have all the information, and now that we have the Final Five, we know that Cavil had more information than we knew all along. It should not be surprising that the non-rebel Cylons now have a place that many of the skin jobs didn’t know about before now.
Sorry if I got the argument wrong. I no longer read CJ’s posts, but I do read those who respond. He/she really sounds like an undergrad who thinks he/she knows how to apply such literary devices to TV. Very obvious when someone is wielding a weapon that is new to him/her.
March 10th, 2009 at 10:14 am
hope we get a answer on the most important question. What’s the name of the “Tattooed pilot”. (probably onr of the last thing they tell us)
March 10th, 2009 at 11:23 am
I will make this short and sweet…
While I respectfully admire everyone’s right to their opinions about the show, I must profess my heartbreak for those that are continually bashing this week. I have my theories and my own set of hopes and dreams for the answers I want. Having said that everyone on here must acknowledge one thing…
Ron Moore has said for years that the story will end in tragedy. He’s said countless times that not everyone will get all the answers they want. He’s said that the story will make sense when completed, however some of you are taking that to imply that all questions will be answered. In any good story in history there are always unanswered questions. The mark of a great story is the “what ifs” that we are left with to draw our own conclusions. If I get all my answers then great…if I don’t then great.
If you have lost faith in this show and need everything spoon fed to you so your imagination can function then by all means, go watch Baywatch reruns or something. Let the story unfold for those of us that understand true great storytelling.
I’m not here to win computers. This site for me is a great place to discuss the greatest show ever made for TV. Constructively criticizing is one thing, bashing is another. Matt and Nat gave us this wonderful site to share our theories about the show and build some wonderful friendships with others that appreciate this show. If you don’t like the show anymore that’s your right, however, please don’t come here continually complaining and hating as it rains on everyone’s parade.
March 10th, 2009 at 12:34 pm
Not sure if this has been mentioned, but I believe Galactica will find the Colony base by using the notes that Hera drew for Starbuck.
I bet they are jump coordinates and that eventually it will lead to where the Colony has repositioned itself. They will probably use a Raptor to jump to each location and then find a ’short cut’ for Galactica to jump to the Colony base (using less jumps).
March 10th, 2009 at 5:07 pm
So say we all Adam.
I agree – you get what you get and it’s up to you to make the best of it – whether that’s BSG, your body, your IQ level, your circumstances.
I admit to bashing ‘Deadlock’ but constructively, I think…
The nasty bellyaching from some people on here about how they think the end will be terribly disappointing is a shame, but hopefully we’ve turned a corner.
Let’s all just wait and see, eh.
Here’s to BSG – may we all raise a glass together, wherever we are, after it fades to black, and celebrate the wonder of it.
Just like Kara raised a glass to all the pilots, and Saul and Adama just raised a glass to Galactica. The ship and the series itself…’She was a Grand Old Lady.’ ‘The Grandest.’
March 10th, 2009 at 5:18 pm
In two weeks it will all be over. Anyone else starting a BSG marathon next Saturday? I’m curious what it will be like to watch each episode with the knowledge of how it will end and what everything means. Will it change how I see the series? Will Daybreak part II be my new favorite episode that I’ll watch over and over and over or will I be smashing all my Galactica DVD and burning a effigy of RDM in the street? I hope there will be a series wrap up episode of BSGcast to see your thoughts on how the show stands up as an entire series.
I’ve had some problems with the last batch of episodes but hopefully I didn’t get put on Tootie’s s blacklist with CJ. I promise not to quote John Lydon anywhere in my posts. As penance for my negative remarks about season 4 I will write “I love BSG, it is the best show ever” one hundred times on the blackboard.
March 10th, 2009 at 5:30 pm
Dennis – While a raptor will find the colony and report back, Galactica will require fewer jumps to get there. Bigger ship – longer legs, as it were.
Actually, I think the Hera’s musical notes will lead to a habitable planet. That will be the impetus to divide the fleet. It could be that the planet is too far for the Gray Lady to reach. The civilian ships will go to the planet while Galactica will attack Cavil. Afterall, the fleet is truly on what Sun Tzu would describe as Desperate Ground.
Someone above mentioned that this might be the last episode with Kara and Lee together. I think they will have one more scene – one on the flight deck where Starbuck joins Adama’s attack while Lee leads the fleet to the habitable planet.
IF – ad I do mean IF – the Fleet jumps to our Earth, I can see two logical “when’s” for it to arrive. The first, and too cutesy, would be if Colonial One docks with the ISS. It’s possible, but I doubt it.
The second possibility is for the fleet to arrive about 5600 BCE in region of what we now call Iraq. The reason I suggest this is because of the ancient Babylonians. Evey offical document always had the official seal: a “Bull with Wings.”
Now, bear with me. Did you ever notice that the Apollo lunar module looks like a face? Don’t the landing pads look like hooves? It would be easy for someone who was ignorant of technology to call it a metal animal. It would not take much imagination for the ships of the fleet to land and have the locals think they look like animals.
And the locals could be descendants from the last War – ones who lost their technology and were starting truly from scratch.
That would mean that we are the next cycle.
March 10th, 2009 at 5:38 pm
And Tootie – I will join you in that toast!
She is the Grandiest Lady of the fleet!
So Say We All!
March 10th, 2009 at 6:23 pm
I have a theory that might be completely obvious to all, and if so I apologize, but here goes: The black goop hasn’t seemed to work, and Adama has now decided (with a great deal of angst) that it’s time to abandon Galactica. What if Galactica is about to have a “rebirth” of her own, with Anders mind energizing the black goop to repair the ship, and in effect, becoming her hybrid? Wouldn’t a reborn Galactica be an interesting development in the final showdown with Cavil?
March 10th, 2009 at 6:34 pm
@ Adam – Thank you. I’ve been thinking the same thing for a bit, tried to say as much, and, honestly, I’ve been tuning out of the discussions here in part because of that negativity – it takes the fun out of it.
March 10th, 2009 at 7:23 pm
@Adam Thanks. Like Signa Jade I’ve been avoiding reading most of the posts due to the negative energy. People have great imaginations and amazing theories, as always, but I didn’t feel like wading through the bashers to get to the good stuff.
I’ll join Tootie and Shauna in the toast:
To Galactica, the gal always had style!
So say we all.
March 10th, 2009 at 8:41 pm
Let’s think back to the end of season 1 and beginning of season 2. Boomer shoots Adama, Cally shoots Boomer, Boomer dies and downloads. Later in “Home” (Part 1, I think) we see Adama looking at Boomer’s body in the morgue. He asks a simple question: “Why?”
However, when Adama reaches Kobol to bring the fleet back together, he encounters Athena (then she was simply Sharon) with Roslin and her party. Naturally Adama gets angry and eventually ends up pinning Athena to the ground at gunpoint. Athena asks quietly: “And you ask yourself Why?”
How is this possible? How does Athena know what Adama said to Boomer’s dead body? This is somewhat of an arbitrary point, but if Athena was somehow connected to Boomer’s dead body, shouldn’t there also exist some connection between Athena and Boomer still when both are alive? Maybe this connection was enough for Boomer to pass as Athena to Hera. Because, let’s face it, if Hera is as important as we think she is, she should be able to tell the difference between her mother and an impostor.
Maybe Hera willingly went with Boomer??? It’s clear that Hera knows more about the Cylons than the Cylons do, so maybe Hera, the three year old, has her own “plan.”
At any rate, this brings me two an observation that may have been made before, but I haven’t read every post, so I’m assuming I’m being original here. Every Significant Seven Cylon agent except for Boomer knew he or she was a Cylon (I think, please feel free to tear me a new one if I’m wrong, it will put the negative energy here to good use).
Why was boomer the only one programmed to think she was human? “Some are programmed to think they are human” I guess this only refers to the Final Five and Boomer. So, my ultimate theory is that Boomer was programmed by Cavil to shoot Adama and do everything she did in the first season. This seems to make sense and works with the story line despite RDM’s thought to write off Boomer (its on his commentary of “Someone to Watch Over Me”).
I think that Boomer, being Cavil’s ‘pet eight’ was programmed by Cavil to be that way. But, Cavil didn’t account for the fact that Boomer, although a machine could “evolve” against her programming. I think Boomer is coming full circle. She started as one of the crew – the Galactica was her home. But after downloading she eventually accepted her true self as a Cylon. Now, after encountering Tyrol and Hera, she is slowly finding her way back “home.”
A scary thought is that Athena might be so scarred from suffering through Helo and Boomer’s frak-fest that she becomes the manipulative Cylon she started out as.
So, the big question is, Will the two Sharons switch places again?
I think so. Yes Boomer appears to be evil at first glance, but by the end of Friday’s episode, she slowly started becoming human again – Hera made that happen. Athena on the other hand, might cross lines back to her deceptive ways and go out in the big way that has been suggested in previous posts.
I can’t wait for Friday. RDM wrote these episodes into four hours of entertainment that had to be cut to three. Either way, I’m expecting a cliff-hanger ending at the end of the nexy episode, but our lust for resolution will come in the sweet form of two hours of BSG bliss.
March 10th, 2009 at 10:37 pm
@CJ….uh…I don’t really get what you’re trying to accomplish. If this is SUCH A BAD SHOW AND YOU NEED TO USE CAPS LOCK ALL THE TIME TO SHOW HOW MUCH YOU HATE IT, why the frak are you watching it? I’m a bit confused. You continue to post about all the crap in this show, and yet you bother to waste your time watching it. If you hate it this much, then just stop. There’s no point watching, let alone post on a forum for it, it you despise it and you scream at it…WITH CAPS LOCK (caps lock is epic
.
Now, I disagree with you. Personally, I’ve loved this whole entire season. I don’t think Season 4 was the weakest season.
I think SEASON 1 was the weakest season. I think it just got better and betters. Seasons 2.0 and 3.0 are probably the best, but 4.5 is pretty amazing, IMO. As is Season 4.0, now that I think of it. I love it all. Each season is something different, but that’s the beauty of it. The show changes, like it should. It’s my favorite show!
4×17 “Someone To Watch Over Me” was pure bliss, IMO. “Deadlock” wasn’t the best episode, but I hate how people are calling this a “soap opera” and yelling at Tigh for crying and complaining about Adama breaking down. And I know, Adama has broken down AGAIN AND AGAIN….AKA twice. I’m pretty sure twice does not count as again and again. The first time was because his best friend is his greatest enemy. Pretty big right there. And are people really trying to complain that it was bad this time, where he breaks down for losing Galactica, the thing he loves most in this world? I just don’t see why. I mean, Tigh and Adama are human beings. They have emotions. Deal with it.
And soap opera? In Sci-Fi world, soap opera means CHARACTER development. I know, “character development” isn’t a word often used in shows like Star Trek (sorry, hate it). This show has always been about the characters, and if you can’t take an episode or two to learn more about the characters and give them a final farewell, then really, what are you watching for? To see things blow up?
When the show is at it’s best, people praise it, and when it’s at its worst, all the fans turn on it in an instant? You didn’t like a few episodes (for reasons I disagree with)…well, that’s a few episodes. It’s not that big of a deal. *shakes head*
March 10th, 2009 at 11:13 pm
The mayans had it all wrong, the world won’t end in 2012, it’s going to end March 21, 2009. The day after we all realize the greatest show to hit sci-fi is gone for good. T.T
March 11th, 2009 at 12:35 am
My theories for what’s going to happen:
It seemed odd that Anders would reinterate that Kara’s the harbinger of death. Maybe she’s fufilling that by plugging Anders in… and then Anders jumping to the colony… which forces Adama to do a suicide mission to save the fleet.
Boomer who now seems to have emotions for Hera, will probably kill Cavil. It would kind of be in symmetry with her shooting Adama at the end of season 1.
Maybe Baltar and Caprica Six will join the mission to rescue Hera during the attack, thus fulfilling the opera house prophecy. Maybe the opera house is the Cylon colony.
March 11th, 2009 at 12:43 am
Oh my I got Fan of the week… sweet!!! I am soo going to frame the photo, thanks Matt & Nat, you two rock!!!!!!!!
For this episode I found it very sad at the end & I needed a drink too :p Looks like the old girl is going to go out kicking and screaming, hope to see lots of ‘rain’ but this is BSG, what a twist if she lived in the end. I wonder who Adama will leave is charge of the fleet??? HotDog??? It is got to be someone we know & that he would trust.
The dream is back, it reminds me of a line from DS9 “the dream has become the dreamer”
Baltar outing StarBuck just seemed a a little out of place, maybe the tone he used, unsure & hesitant a little in the start.
thanks again Matt & Nat.
March 11th, 2009 at 12:51 am
@ ? is it’n the Tattooed pilot ‘Shoe Shine’?
March 11th, 2009 at 2:03 am
First off, RatTat, congrats on winning FotW.
Matt and Nat: Great that you mentioned my theory on the song. Also, to answer your question about the missing “God fearing Centurions”, I believe that an answer has already been provided. If you remember, in the Unrated Extended cut of the TV movie “Razor”, Athena made mention that the Guardians were Centurions that “somehow escape recycling”. So, it’s possible that those “God fearing Centurions” got recycled while others got away and started to protect the Hybrid seen in “Razor”. As to explain why we see an old-school Raider in the “parking lot”, it’s possible that the Raider is one of the Guardians’ Raiders post Hybrid Basestar destruction. Think about it like this: The old Centurions sole purpose were to protect the Hybrid. Without the hybrid, they had no purpose and they may have decided to head back to the Colony to accept their eventual end. And its possible that the old school Raider we see hadn’t been recycled yet (think about it, the Cylons had been rather busy trying to find Earth, destroy the humans and now trying to reconstruct resurrection technology). Of course, I could be wrong.
BTW, did you two get the e-mail I sent to you? I know I said take your time in reading over the info, but I wasn’t sure if you received it or not. If you have or not, just shoot me a quick reply and let me know (if you didn’t, then I’ll be more than happy to resend the e-mail and info).
March 11th, 2009 at 6:30 am
Hey guys check this out: RDM, Eick, EJO & McDonnell are gonna meet Un representatives on March, 17. They are gonna watch a BSG retrospective and discuss “how the show examined issues such as “human rights, children and armed conflict, terrorism, human rights and reconciliation and dialogue among civilizations and faith,” according to Sci Fi.
That’s pretty cool!
More here:
http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2009/03/battlestar-galactica-united-nations.html
And to think some still tyhink BSG “big ships & robots in space”. Of course it has Robots & such. But it is so much more….
March 11th, 2009 at 10:06 am
HEY! WHAT THE FRAK GUYS!?! I HAD THAT AS THE MAIN PART OF MY POAST UNTUCHED BY ALL IT WAS THE FIRST THING I THOUGHT OF WHEN HERA GAVE IT TO STARBUCK!!!!!!!!! CANT I AT LEAST GET SOME RECOGNITION FOR THAT!!!!!
March 11th, 2009 at 10:24 am
Well i think that hera when she was playing with the model bsg and she crashes it into the cylon basestar i think this is a peice of foreshadowing maybe that the galactica pulls a pegasus crashes into the colony or giant ship thing thats my thoughts on that part
Kara whell i think she might find a clon model of herself maybe idk simon did take a ovarie right couldnt they make another one or maybe daniel could be in hiding he could be guiding her.
March 11th, 2009 at 10:29 am
sorry about my horrible typing skills
Well i think that hera when she was playing with the model bsg and she crashes it into the cylon basestar i think this is a peice of foreshadowing maybe that the galactica pulls a pegasus and crashes into the colony or giant ship thing thats my thoughts on that part
Kara whell i think she might find a cylon model of herself maybe idk simon did take a ovarie right couldnt they make another one or maybe daniel could be in hiding he could be guiding her. maybe daniel had made her so many unaswered question i want a frak party but i know no one else who watches this show
March 11th, 2009 at 11:04 am
Matt and Kat: Great going on accurately describing the furor over the non-plot these past three episodes (Although, “Someone to Watch Over Me” was OK) have gotten and how Ron Moore has explicitly stated he has NO INTENTION of answering the big questions.
Bravo.
March 11th, 2009 at 12:50 pm
What if bsg takes place during the time of Noah and the flood? The Galactica or the entire fleet could be the ark.And Adama could be Noah.The bible talks about beings called the Nephelim.What if the cylons are these nephelim.In the bible it says that the sons of god mated with the daughters of men producing hybrids.So god sent the flood to wipe them all out and only noah and his family were saved. Then after the flood there was a “new Earth” since the old one was destroyed by the flood(Cylons). The planet in Revelations called Earth could be the old one and at the end they will find a new Earth which will be our Earth.
March 11th, 2009 at 1:08 pm
MONDAY MARCH 16TH 10 PM EASTERN, 9 CENTRAL ETC. – on SCI FI…PROBABLY SPACE TOO!
‘THE LAST FRAKKING SPECIAL’
BEHIND THE SCENES LOOK AT THE MAKING OF BSG!
March 11th, 2009 at 4:15 pm
@CJ- First off, it’s NAT not KAT.
Second of all, Ron Moore stated in the audio commetary for “Someone to Watch Over Me” that he intends on answering some of the big questions, because he has no intention of leaving them over to be answered in “Caprica”. I repeat, he intends on answering SOME of the big questions. Not all. And as I’ve said before, it’s okay if we don’t get all the answers. That’s how it is in real life. We ask questions, we get opinions, but definitive answers we do not. We’ve asked “Are we alone in this universe?” for decades, and we still haven’t had the answer though we keep asking. That’s the way real life is. The show, which prides itself on realism when it comes to characters, follows that rule. Don’t expect to have all the answers, just be happy that we’re getting some.
March 11th, 2009 at 7:30 pm
Galactica on its suicide mission….
Moves near, or inside Cavil’s Colony. Anders…. “Jump!!!”
Spacial Disruption…. Tears Colony’s guts out.
Galactica appears…. somewhere significant.
March 11th, 2009 at 7:38 pm
I can now see the ripples in the stream.
Anders will take control of Galactica during the final battle. The cylon centurions will immediately recognize him as one of the five and refuse to attack. OR, the original cylons will be involved in the battle and side with Galactica.
March 11th, 2009 at 7:40 pm
Oh yea, before the jump, huge fight ensues, Hera is rescued, but something else important happens or is discovered by fighters or Hera. Questions are answered.
Oh and Caprica Six dies, because she has to protect Hera with her life as she said. Baltar will be involved somehow also, for he is seen leaving the Opera House with Hera and CSix. Perhaps he is captured by by the Cylon forces, bringing them the One God they will believe in in the next cycle. I’m still sketchy on Baltar’s role in the end.
March 11th, 2009 at 7:54 pm
All of this has happened before and all of this will happen agai- again. Again. Again.
Nat questioned about the original Centurions- their role.
I really hope their role as “Guardians of the first Hybrid” (Razor episode) comes back to the show.
And Cavil appears to fufill the “Imperious Leader” ruling New Caprica through the use of Fear, and Murder.
I predict a good ole Starbuck plan of jumping the Galactica into the danger zone(Empty ship) whilst the Basestar tears apart the remains of Cavil’s Fleet.
Dylan=14thCylon Says “Maybe the opera house is the Cylon colony.”
I’d really be interested in seeing the entire Cylon Colony projecting themselves in the opera house. the final 5 conduct something special at the opera house (maybe the song is the key to unlocking ressurection?)
I do agree Baltar will come out as the survivor and savior of Hera. Whether it has been his natural instinct or through his 6 Conscience that has kept him alive and has given him the right path to excercise energy towards others.Whether or not Caprica 6 will pardon Baltar- i cant guess.
The rest of the fight lies in Starbuck and Hera. The descendant of Daniel. There to claim her spot (and voice) in the cylon congregation.
March 11th, 2009 at 8:15 pm
Other thoughts:
Opera House…
All Along The Watch Tower…
Final Five seen in Opera House…
Hera seen in Opera House…
Hera writes All Along the Watch Tower…
Final Five hears All Along the Watch Tower…
Kara plays All Along the Watch Tower…
Baltar, Six, Diana, Athena, Roselin are all seen in the Opera House wanting to do something about, or be involved in whats happening in the Opera House, but in the end can always only watch it unfold.
Hera is the Composer, or Conductor
Kara COULD be the Conductor, the Performer or the Orchestra
Final Five would then be the Orchestra if Kara is the Conductor.
Baltar, Six, Diana, Athena, Roselin could be merely be the audience, watching, having some idea of the performance on stage.
Prophets to everyone (Human and Cylon) not able to really see the performance, Prophets… that’s it!!! They are Prophets!!! WOW… Eureka moment for me. (Baltar being the Jesus figure)
Why is Kara never seen in the Opera House or have a vision of it?
Perhaps Kara’s dad, Danial, didn’t teach her the song. Perhaps, she taught him. This reveals something significant to him about the war, humanity, Cavil, Earth, life, death, whatever. But this causes him to leave, causes him to be boxed. But just a random thought I had.
Kara is the hand of Hera. The hand of God. An Angel, carrying out God’s commands or LOK
Perhaps Hera is using her “knowledge” to “Manipulate” everyone. Knowing Galactica and her Angels would follow her and bring destruction to Cavil’s Cylons, which is why she allowed Boomer to take her. If she was faking her performance in the Raptor with Boomer then she is one hell of a manipulator (there is a moment when she suddenly stops crying, and you can almost see a smile). Then she projects with Boomer, manipulating her too, to feel guilty and become an asset.
Anyway, these are all just some things I was try to rationalize. Not really rational, but in the context of the BSG Universe minds open.
March 11th, 2009 at 8:30 pm
Just an idea…
What if in the next cycle JCavil will be who Baltar is now. And in the last cycle, Baltar was who JCavil is now. Or visa versa.
We know Baltar helped engineer the holocaust, knowingly, unknowingly, subconsciously.
That was his JCavil instinct, before is current redemption.
In the Classic series, Baltar was very much in the shoes of the current JCavil.
MAT and NAT !!! If you guys like, or even notice/recognize Goku is Cylon, give me a little hint hint in the PCast… not like the other guy from last week though. I think he stole that theory about the notes being coordinates from me be by the way. I had posted it on Scifi.com BSG forum, weeks and weeks ago. Anyways. I love you guys, I hope the end of BSG isn’t the end of your PCasts, come back for Caprica!!! Hey maybe you should hurry and grab the domain name CapricaCast.com before anyone else.
March 11th, 2009 at 9:49 pm
If the goal of the mission is to destroy Cavil and his Cylons, maybe they’ll fly Galactica right into the middle of that giant Cylon ship, do what the have to, and make an FTL jump while they’re still inside. If something the size of a Raptor jumping right next to Galactica caused as much damage as it did, imagine if a ship like Galactica jumped inside of an even larger ship? Plus, that might not necessarily destroy Galactica (although she would definitely take heavy damage in there) they could still do damage and make an awesome exit. I suppose we’ll just have to wait and see, though.
March 11th, 2009 at 10:13 pm
@ Goku is Cylon…
I DID NOT STEAL ANYTHING FROM YOU OR ANYONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The Last time I went to Sci-fi forum was when I posted a thread about the BluRay release this year, that was about 3+ weeks ago…
leave me out of it.
& I am Not a he :p
March 11th, 2009 at 10:16 pm
Hera didnt write all along the watchtower. It was fracking Bob Dylan! If BSG does indeed take place in our futer than Dylan and possibly Jimi Hendrix have to be connected in some way.If it takes place millions of years in the past than mabey kara,hera, or one of the F5 wrote it down on some rock or something on Earth and bob dylan picked it up.That city could have been Atlantis rather than NYC. Or perhaps he had his own head angel or even God tell him the lyrics and tune. Another one of dylans songs that I hope they at least make a reference to is knockin on heavens door. It also fits quite well with the story. I also know that RDM said that Dylan was not necessarily a character in BSG but if Earth is indeed our Earth in the future than he actually is.
March 11th, 2009 at 10:43 pm
“Dylan and possibly Jimi Hendrix have to be connected in some way”
im sure they have been inspiration just as the songs sung in Gaelic and Armenian have somewhat of a hidden message(if you dont speak/read those languages)
I really dont believe they will be pulling Bob Dylan Jimmy Hendrix and the Experience from the grave in the last episodes of this series
The Watchtower has ambigious lyrics
And it is said that Pythia was a fortune teller who gave notable fortunes of high ambiguity.
Tomorrow is never promised but come. on.
March 11th, 2009 at 10:46 pm
Perhaps Hera is using her “knowledge” to “Manipulate” everyone. Knowing Galactica and her Angels would follow her and bring destruction to Cavil’s Cylons, which is why she allowed Boomer to take her. If she was faking her performance in the Raptor with Boomer then she is one hell of a manipulator (there is a moment when she suddenly stops crying, and you can almost see a smile). Then she projects with Boomer, manipulating her too, to feel guilty and become an asset
I would totally agree with this but-
wasn’t Baltar was already talking to “himself” before Hera was even conceived?
March 11th, 2009 at 10:47 pm
Maybe im not understanding what you’re saying :/
March 12th, 2009 at 12:31 am
I want the record to show that I called it first: Kara is a head being.
March 12th, 2009 at 9:25 am
“I really dont believe they will be pulling Bob Dylan Jimmy Hendrix and the Experience from the grave in the last episodes of this series”
That gives me a great idea!
I know what the ending is gonna be! At the end well find out that there all really pot smoking hippies at the woodstock concert and the whole series was just them imaging it all from getting so high.And it would all take place during when hendrix was playing all along the watchtower! It would be sorta like a not really happened dream ending. But that would leave the open question as to how they all shared the same vision.
March 12th, 2009 at 9:30 am
Also dylan isnt dead. Hendrix is though.
March 12th, 2009 at 9:45 am
‘No reason to get excited, the thief, he kindly spoke,
There are many here among us who feel that life is but a joke.
But you and i, weve been through that, and this is not our fate,
So let us not talk falsely now, the hour is getting late.’
March 12th, 2009 at 11:20 am
“When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. “-Hendrix
March 12th, 2009 at 11:23 am
“All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie. “-Dylan.
These quotes seem to summarize the entirety of BSG
March 12th, 2009 at 11:24 am
If thats the ending to come. Matrix Revolutions just lost the award for “worst ending ever”
Even throughout the series nothing has ever landed fully on a happy tone.
Finding new caprica?
Finding earth?
Peace?
Yea something is “up in smoke”
March 12th, 2009 at 11:27 am
@ RatTat
Nothing personal. Sorry, I wasn’t trying to accuse you. I was just saying i had come up with the same theory. Irrelevant anyway, you got the photo. Congratulations.
Oh and sorry, about mistaking you for a guy.
March 12th, 2009 at 11:32 am
DarthRazorback Says: “Anders will take control of Galactica during the final battle. The cylon centurions will immediately recognize him as one of the five and refuse to attack.”
Great call – Definitely going to happen. I hope the cylon goo and Anders can save her after all.
I think this jump-disruption thing may be the only offense Galactica will have…if she can’t do salvo fire or nukes? It’s another option anyway, as is ramming.
DarthRazorback Says: “OR, the original cylons will be involved in the battle and side with Galactica.”
Why? Explain please.
Caprica and Baltar and Hera will survive. They pass through the golden door in the opera house!
Regarding getting answers – I don’t care what Kara is really. Would be nice to know, but don’t really care too much. Where they’ll end up and who will survive will obviously be answered. Whether the cycle will continue will probably be answered but may not be answered. Why Hera is so special and has connective powers may not be answered…again, don’t really care.
Keep in mind, those of you who DO want many or all questions answered – there may be some answers in Ron’s podcasts, in terms of his thoughts on things…
My ending? (yours too?) Galactica attacks Cavil, good guys kill all evil guys and rescue Hera and no good guys die (except maybe Helo and/or Sharon, let’s be realistic) and the Colony is destroyed, lots of guns and explosions, kick ass!
Galactica barely returns or is destroyed (Sam too), but good guys return safetly to fleet with Hera.
The fleet finds another Earth and all live happily ever after on it, lots of cabins beside crystal clear streams and weed waving in the wind. Except Roslin doesn’t quite make it. Lee and Kara start a new life. Baltar expands his harem to include many Sixes, whatever.
If this happens, I will be really happy. But Ron says the ending won’t be what we expect…what the hell does that mean? I am worried.
However, I am sure it will be interesting and make sense and I trust him to a large extent.
I will raise a glass no matter what.
March 12th, 2009 at 11:45 am
I think the ultimate question to BSG that can answer all others is… Who is Hera/Kara really; reincarnated, whatever, How did she know “All Along the Watch Tower”? Is it merely a genetic memory from her Cylon side? But that would almost certainly mean all Humanoid Cylons carry that song in their genetic code. Remember the 8 on her death bed quoting the song. No one who is clearly Human have been involved with the song. Excluding Kara, assuming she is human, and I don’t think she is… entirely or anymore.
New theory:
Something, somewhere, is broadcasting the song. Only those of Cylon decent can pick-up the transmission. Remember the FF could only begin to hear the song when Galactica arrived at the Malestrom, I don’t think they have heard the song since then, aside from Kara playing it on the Piano. I don’t even think they were hearing it on Earth. To me the only explanation is that the song is a secret code leading somewhere significant.
The song is linked to death in some way. I don’t know how.
March 12th, 2009 at 11:51 am
Perhaps because hendrix is dead!? Though he didnt write the song he made it famous.
March 12th, 2009 at 12:15 pm
@ Tootie
Don’t take this the wrong way but I think your being entertained only by the show on one level. What happens to Humanity and the Cylons, etc. Which is actually the “big picture”. Which is fine. But there are other layers of BSG, some independent others. All of them having their own set of questions, whose fans want answered. Or whose fans like to theorize the answers.
I say that to say this, try and look at the show, not in it’s entirety but, but look at the how and why. It might make the show that much more enthralling for you; or it might not.
March 12th, 2009 at 12:19 pm
I strongly believe, that Galactica is going to really hurt Cavil and his men… just remember all those nukes she had back in “Eye of Jupiter” or what episode it was.
When then ramming something, I can definitely see her taking out all of Cavils fleet…
would be a nice ending
March 12th, 2009 at 12:31 pm
Tomorrow is Friday and I am – of course – obsessing (a little) over the BSG finale and what we may see – and get answered – during “Daybreak, Part I”.
Now, I only watch the TV episodes on SciFi and haven’t seen the “podcasts” or “webisodes” for myself. However, I am inclined to believe, based (in part) on many of your comments from sources and content outside of the TV episodes, that not all of our questions will be answered. My first “knee jerked” reaction was frustration. I wanted all of the loose ends tied up neatly – each with plausible and non-conflicting answers. As I began to resolve myself to the fact that the series finale was going to leave at least some of the “big” questions unanswered, I found my frustration being replaced by acceptance.
I think back about my own childhood and the single best day of the Christmas season was always Christmas Eve. After the initial rush of tearing open presents on Christmas Day, my interest quickly faded and it became a day, like any other. My true excitement was found in the ANTICIPATION of the gifts I would receive – even more than in the gifts themselves.
Flashing forward, I have thoroughly enjoyed the speculation and theorizing about all of the questions RDM has left for the finale. However, I now realize that if I do get ALL of the answers I wanted, there would be nothing left for me to ponder and BSG will truly end.
I think we will get enough answers to leave us satisfied that the time and energy we have invested into BSG these past several years was well spent. But when the final credits roll, there will still be some questions and mystery left in the BSG universe and that is how it should be. The joy of watching has been in following the journey and the destination – whatever it is – doesn’t really matter. In the end, BSG made us all think, held our interest and kept us entertained – high praise indeed for a TV show.
Here’s wishing you all a very happy BSG Eve!
“To the journey…”
March 12th, 2009 at 12:34 pm
So Say We All
March 12th, 2009 at 12:51 pm
So Say We All !!!
March 12th, 2009 at 2:11 pm
Oh man, I just saw the promo for the “Last fracking Special” that is going to air on Scifi on Monday. Toward the end of it, it looks like eddie olmos in a viper!! I totally want to see a viper squadron made up of both Adamas, Starbuck, and Tigh. That would make for kick-ass dogfights. Cavil doesn’t stand a chance.
March 12th, 2009 at 2:27 pm
& the BSG special is 1 hour this time
For Kara I would not hold my breath… I read a spoiler interview & it hinted that we MAY NOT find out what Kara is in the end, IF that is true I hope Ron tells us in a pod cast on the DVD/Bluray or the movie this summer.
March 12th, 2009 at 3:29 pm
Instead of making your new site CapricaCast, name it CapriCast, sounds much better.
March 12th, 2009 at 4:33 pm
I, personally, think that the planet behind boomers raptor WAS jupiter. And that when galactica figures out where the colony is, they will jump, but only get halfway, and find themselves in OUR solar system, and find the REAL earth. this makes Roslin decide that the fleet should land and live there. but then she starts to (really) die, and Adama (knowing that she won’t survive) tries to take her to their new “home” before she dies, but she does (maybe on the way down to the planet?). anyway, Adama decides that since he has nothing left that he will send galactica into battle to destroy the colony, he does… I dunno what happens to hera… or boomer. but, yeah, the rest of the cylons either die via giganticsplosion or surrender or jump away. And the rest of the colonials decide to get rid of their technology to “break the cycle” and settle on the new planet. they call it “Earth” in honour of all their hopes and dreams. after thousands of years, the difference between cylon and colonial has dissapeared. and all of their stories become the legends and myths beloning to many ancient cultures, humanity and cylonity(?) get a fresh start… but then they frak it all up by inventing nukes… again…
as for kara, hera, and the opera house? I don’t know. I was just proposing an idea of where the PLOT could go.
also, I’m sorry about my offensive grammar and spelling, and abuse of tenses….. yeah… ^^;
March 12th, 2009 at 5:09 pm
I actually had a similar idea as RatTat and Guku is a Cylon but my theory was that the colonials will go back to earth, find a cave that has a musical organ that looks like giant skull, lets call it the bone organ, then Starbuck will play All Along the Watchtower and a door in the cave will magically open and lead them to a pirate ship with One Eyed Willie’s secret treasure. Then with the treasure money, the colonial can pay the cylons to stop following them. The end. Roslyn still dies though.
Sloth love Starbuck
March 12th, 2009 at 5:13 pm
Hey, I just realized something. It may be nothing, but possibly something. The last two episodes are titled “Daybreak”, right? The definition of the word “daybreak” is simply, “dawn” (according to Webster’s Online, here: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/daybreak ). Aurora is the goddess of the dawn. And we’ve seen the Aurora statue handed to Starbuck then to Adama (and back to Starbuck via Apollo in a deleted scene in Season 4.0). So, maybe “Daybreak” has something more than the end of the Galactica. Possibly, a new beginning that applies to “All of this has happened before, and it will happen again”?
That, or it’s an homage to the French film, “Daybreak”, which deals with a character who holes up in his apartment after killing a guy for a woman (which may apply to Adama and him wanting to go down with the Galactica).
March 12th, 2009 at 6:32 pm
Goku is Cylon, thanks for the note! I appreciate it.
When I stated what I want to see happen, that is what I want to see happen, in terms strictly of the plot. I would love it if the bad guys (Cavil) were destroyed, most or all good guys end up having a future happy life.
I hope RDM allows for that future to be possible, for them to reach a planet that looks good or whatever…it would be nice. I would like that. I love these characters.
When I say I don’t care if we find out what Kara is and how she came back from the dead – and that I don’t really care if we find out why Hera is special – or why Roslin is connected to the cylons via the opera house, etc. – doesn’t mean it isn’t important to find out, or that I don’t wonder….I do. But I am not going to worry if I don’t get definitive answers on these things. There have been a few unexplained things happen in my life, and if I never find out about those things, that’s ok. They happened, they are real, and I take them for what they are.
As far as the big themes of BSG (what does it mean to be human, to be worthy of survival, to coexist and trust in peace, to retain your humanity when faced with extraordinary circumstances, the meaning of life, to love and strive to be a better person) – these have already been addressed fully in BSG. That is, we don’t need any further material, any further episodes, to develop these themes. We don’t need anything particular to happen in ‘Daybreak’ for these themes will be fully explored.
We’ve already seen the themes play out to perfection: characters choose allegiances (Boomer, Sharon), find themselves and the meaning of life (Lee, the final five, many others), take action or not take action in an effort of being worthy of survival (e.g. Adama and Cain deciding not to execute each other, Kendra Shaw), sacrifice their lives for the good of others, not even necessarily of their species (Six in the latest episode, Cat, others), to love and strive to be a better person (Kara, Baltar, others).
If ‘Daybreak’ is not needed to develop BSG’s themes however, it is necessary to develop and complete plot and characters, the other two pillars of a story.
Plot – I’ve already said what I hope to see.
Characters – We will see ‘final’ choices being made in ‘Daybreak’ – final in the sense that these are the last choices we will see these characters make, and in some cases, final in the sense of final because some characters will die.
These choices will indeed give final definition to each character. These choices will in some cases be consistent with the character’s actions so far, and so won’t develop the character further. They will in this case, just be a completion of the character. (A good example would be Adama going down with his ship, giving his life to look after the fleet.)
In some cases, these final choices will define the character in new ways. They won’t be particularly consistent with actions taken in the past, or will go far beyond what we’ve seen before. (A good example here is probably Baltar – we will likely see him set aside his self-serving ways as he has been wont to do of late, but this will go far beyond past actions and define him in a new way. He has wavered as a true leader, afraid to set aside his safety and comfort if it meant making choices that would protect everyone, even if it meant his life would have meaning. I think he will truly become the leader he has the potential to be (and give himself the gift of a meaningful life), as Roslin indicated in her parting presidential letter to him on her deathbed the first time, long ago. He’s thought of himself as unworthy of a meaningful life, but that may change.)
I am greatly looking forward to seeing the choices these characters make.
No, I don’t give a frak if the mythology or phenomenons are explained partially or fully.
The themes have been developed.
I do hope, as I have said, that in terms of plot, some of the characters end up in circumstances where they can be happy and safe…because I’m a sap and I care a frak of a lot.
I am keeping my fingers crossed hard.
March 12th, 2009 at 6:41 pm
Wow that was really good. I am glad ‘Goku is Cylon’ initiated my thinking on this.
I am such a nerd!
March 12th, 2009 at 6:43 pm
I meant ‘good’ in the sense of being enjoyable and therapeutic for me!
March 12th, 2009 at 6:50 pm
Quick note…
Incase no one made the connection…
Nine solid notes are planets and one hollow note is a space station/ship.
I think the planets are ours. Long live the planet Pluto……
March 12th, 2009 at 7:06 pm
Got a link to the frak party in London??
March 12th, 2009 at 8:06 pm
Thee_Immortal_One we actually have 13 planets if you include all the dwarf ones. Ceres,Pluto,Haumea,Makemake, and Eris! Than add the 8 and thats 13!
March 12th, 2009 at 8:09 pm
Wait a minute. 13 planets,13 tribes,13 original states,13 tribes of Israel. Hmmm.
March 12th, 2009 at 8:25 pm
Purple haze all in my brain
Lately things just dont seem the same
Actin funny, but I dont know why
scuse me while I kiss the sky
Purple haze all around
Dont know if Im comin up or down
Am I happy or in misery?
What ever it is, that girl put a spell on me
Help me Help meOh, no, no
Hammerin
Talkin bout heart n…s-soul
Im talkin about hard stuff
If everbodys still around, fluff and ease, if
So far out my mind
Somethings happening, somethings happening
Ooo, ahhh
Ooo, ahhh, yeah!
Purple haze all in my eyes, uhh
Dont know if its day or night
You got me blowin, blowin my mind
Is it tomorrow, or just the end of time?
Yep hendrix is a cylon to!
March 12th, 2009 at 8:31 pm
R.I.P -JH He may have not written all along the watchtower but he did make it better.
March 12th, 2009 at 8:39 pm
“I had always had this idea of using that particular song in the show as a marker that there were other things going on here. There was this idea developed early in the series, that one of the Colonial scriptures says, ”All of this has happened before and all of it will happen again,” that certain elements and situations and even people repeat in a cycle of destruction and rebirth and exodus and chase, etc. One of the ideas I wanted to play was, okay, if you found a song that we, the audience, recognize, you realize that you have a connection to this world too, and suddenly other pieces start to fit. Well, why do they wear suits and ties? Why do they look so much like us? What is the connection between them and us? It would put in stark relief the idea that there is a connection between the people on Galatica and our experience on Earth.” – RON MOORE, ET Weekly. http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20036782_20037403_20015932_3,00.html
March 13th, 2009 at 4:04 am
Why exactly do people think that Kara is a head being? I’m highly confused as to this theory that has popped up so many times. What we knw of head beings is that:
* Only one person (presumably) is able to see them.
= Only Baltar can see Head-Six and Head-Baltar.
= Only Kara could see Head-Dad
* Head characters can (presumably) interact with their contacts physically.
= Head-Six picking Baltar up after he’d been beaten (can’t remember the episode, but people witnessed the odd behaviour…)
= Kara being able to smell the tobacco from head-Dad (we assume, cos otherwise we’d have to worry about her sense of smell…)
* Head characters CAN’T (presumably) interact physically with anything else.
= In four years we haven’t seen Head-Six pick up a pen and paper…
= Head Dad’s music notes disappeared with him, leaving no trace of evidence of his physical presence…
So, with those three things in mind….
Kara has interacted with just about everyone on the damn ship. There’s no one who CAN’T see her.
Kara has been able to interact with physical objects. She’s flown a viper, she’s lead meetings, and if she were one of these imaginery friends like Head-Six, then a WHOLE lot of people are able to see her.
And, you’ll noe that I’ve presumed a lot about the head-characters, but everything from canon sugests that those three points hold true in every instance we’ve seen. So…
Where the heck did this theory come from? Someone explain why and how this theory can possibly work, when everything that we’ve seen of the head-characters has been similar in every instance, i.e. only ONE person able to see and interact with them. Seriously, explain, please?
I’m truly curious why people think Kara or even Baltar could be head-characters when they are such huge players and have had so much interaction, both with physical objects, and other characters. Anyone? Explain? Please??
March 13th, 2009 at 4:15 am
@Kattie- About your comment: “In four years we haven’t seen Head-Six pick up a pen and paper…” That is true about pen and paper. However, it is not true to say that we haven’t seen her pick up something. If you look at Season 1’s “Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down”. In the scene after the opening credits, in which she and Baltar are in the lab, they are talking about how long it would take to process all the blood samples by everyone in the Fleet. During this conversation, she picks up a vial of blood and plays with it before placing it back down. Just figured I’d share that bit of info.
March 13th, 2009 at 4:56 am
There’s no more time for theories, questions, new terminologies, ideas, hypotheses, speculations, contrition, theses, assumptions, beliefs, conclusions, conjectures, propositions, suppositions, reasons, inferences, plans, laws, conditions, axioms, philosophies, conceptions or ideologies.
We’re heading towards out conclusion and all we can do is sit back and enjoy the ride.
It is time, to know the truth!
March 13th, 2009 at 5:35 am
In the last two episodes
Battlestar will jump in, and the basestar will jump in. There will be mad fighting. The centurions and the raiders will put a stop to the fighting after great bloodshed has occurred and they realize that the “skins” (human and cylon alike) are gonna destroy everything.
*scene cut*
Dawn is breaking over a child’s room adorned by various decorations such as horses and starscapes, and there may even be some toys left out on the floor. Camera pans over the bed where we see movement under the covers. The covers are pulled down to reveal a small dark-haired child.
Hera wakes up and smiles when she realizes she has just been dreaming.
That’s right. This entire series is the dream of a 3 year-old child.
That means it doesn’t matter when everyone dies cause no one really died. lol.
How bad would it be if that was how it really ended.
No more fan of the week contests makes me very sad. No more BSG makes me very sad. Nat, after this show is over, if you want something to do look me up. I’m free for the rest of my life girl.
March 13th, 2009 at 10:34 am
I predict most of the colonials will die and be ressurected on a different Earth than what we have seen already. Kara has already died and been resurected on earth. Her ship was rebuilt by the other resurected colonials on earth and was sent back to the fleet to help with the transition. The head characters are also guiding the colonials to the new earth, by making them accept God and trust in him that if they die they will be ressurected into a new life.
March 14th, 2009 at 12:40 am
Final thought on this thread…..
Humans will transistion to a higher beingness. The cylons will be left behind.
March 15th, 2009 at 10:25 pm
JUPITER
JUPITER
JUPITER….
NO One ever sees the fact that Jupiter, jupitar , or what ever it is, is right in the middle!!!
boomer and herra stop near Jupiter,,,,,,,,,EARTH`s Jupiter , real earth
JUPITER is the half way point between the cylonians ( humans and the other cylons) and the other cylons
Cavil is still the devil (Patrick McAnee) and Adama the leader ( not savior),,,,,,
And now we have Herra as Dr. Z
You Nerds, ( i am one of them) sould get out and look, LOOK at the skies above
JSF
March 20th, 2009 at 7:31 am
The “all this has happen and will happen again” try to get out of this vicious circle business … I finally go it! … it is in fact a strong message/solution/theory to the end of every war humanity faced, faces are will face. The way to break the circle showed is by the ability of the cyclone raiders to have the faculty to be able to ‘believe’ and the ability to make one with the human population (something even matrix3 show with their programmed child girl). Aka: merging people identity like the EU goal instead of having a nation per identity like India & Pakistan for contrast this being the only way to peace.
Ironical how a heavy army oriented series actually main message is offering the ultimate peace message. We go from hating the cylons for every thing they strand-for and represents in the mini-series, to doing a 180 perspective tune, in only 4 short series. Now we find ourselves, like Commander Adama, seeing there humanity and wanting them to start a melting pot with the human race! Heck we even have enough volunteers for a totally suicidal mission in this episode to prove that lol
BTW … just so that we are clear …the only cylone model there fighting against are the “brother tyrile” line-up and a fracked up 8. All the other model following him are in reality just misinformed or lobotomised
I like the fact that he is model nb1, makes it sound to me like no coincidence, implying that he is not a finished product, and so could cope with the changes laid up in front of him. Cool thought how him alone single handedly manage to silences the 5 original models and put the reverse gear on there project.
I can’t wait to be given an explication of the head’s/angels apparitions; my personal theory is that resurrection process has an inheritance/pragmatic flaw that makes cylon/human going though it become skysofrean. This resurrection unsolvable “flaw” makes resurrection not a valid long term solution. It would explain why the 13een tribe dropping it and reverted in using reproduction instead. This theory of mine would only hold up if Baltare was killed by the nuclear blast back on Caprica. Truly hope this will be reviled in this upcoming two-parter.
Could any one explain to me what’s up with Clara being 100% human! Was she then simply adopted by here father Dave (nb7)?
My favourite BSG quote in retrospects is the last words of S02E02 where colonel tie says “Thank the Gods I didn’t have kids”. Don’t you love the irony in this!
Ho … and one more thing…
Could the opera-house be actually happening in a totally different environment? with everyone experiencing it, simply sharing a common virtual projection around the real surroundings. I was toying with the idea since projection is having an incising role in the story, and also would offer a great in-you-face smack-up of what that crucial seen will truly be about.
November 23rd, 2009 at 8:10 am
Try not to become a man of success but rather to become a man of value.
March 26th, 2010 at 11:36 pm
Praise God for all He is doing. Thanks!
April 8th, 2010 at 5:21 pm
I dont often read blogs or even comment on blogs but I did find your pretty intresting toread through, Do you mind if I ask what theme you are using for this blog, Im guessing its a wordpress blog?