CapriCast 1.02 – Rebirth
After months of waiting, the story of Caprica finally moves forward with Zoe in her new Cylon body as the Graystone and Adama families try to cope with tragedy.
This episode gives us lots to talk about from the new theme song and opening credit sequence to the concept of group marriages and little Willy’s life of crime. What did you think of the first steps in the series?
February 4th, 2010 at 6:44 pm
woohoo!!! I have been checking everyday sine the new episode. I look forward to many seasons of capricast! (cross fingers)
February 4th, 2010 at 7:28 pm
I enjoyed ‘Rebirth” even more than the pilot, which I also enjoyed. I loved the Zoe / Cylon filming technique. I loved finding out more about Sam Adama and Sister Clarice. It was good to have more from Amanda Greystone. And the opening credits rocked! Though I’d say I wasn’t sold on the opening credits or Amanda’s reveal at the end the first time I watched it, the 2nd time I enjoyed it a lot more. I love that Sam is gay; and so refreshingly revealed. I was hoping he’d tell Bill that sometimes you just have to roll the hard six! Seeing how Zoe / Cylon is treated it’s very easy to see how the Cylons could resent their treatment by humans. All the little ties to BSG were nice to see. I hope the show lasts a long, long time, because so far I think it’s a fantastic series.
February 5th, 2010 at 1:03 am
I can’t wait for your take on “Rebirth” Matt & Nat. I enjoyed this episode as well as the pilot. The start to this episode reminds me of the episode 4.17 “No Exit” when Ellen Resurrects. It’s almost as if Zoe was resurrecting in her Cylon body. I can’t wait for this weeks episode. Im like mountaieer in keeping my fingers crossed for many seasons to come.
February 5th, 2010 at 4:31 am
Everything was good : the opening credits, the Zoe-Cylon story, the Adamas, the Greystones and the ending was for me a good cliff-hanger.
Liked it more than the pilot.
And of course, your review was the best!
February 5th, 2010 at 10:17 am
Yeah, I really enjoyed this episode. After the pilot (which I saw forever ago) I didn’t think the show was going to be very interesting. But I was hooked. The whole Being a Toron stuff was really cool.
I agree with Mat I HATED Zoe in the pilot. Did not like at all. But then the way the show her hear and how her story develops from this point is so cool.
Caprica, I’m in there.
Keep The Statue
February 5th, 2010 at 11:39 am
I am still comparing it too much to BSG, I guess, but I’m really not happy.
I haven’t found a single character I can relate to in terms of their struggles etc. I guess the closest would be the Zoe avatar just after Zoe is killed, but I just can’t connect with her in this episode, a robot wandering around her bedroom…I don’t care about any of the other characters at all. Joseph is more concerned about getting technology to apease his gange than grieving. Greystone only cares about technology. And Amanda? Please. I am supposed to feel sympathy for her as she watches old movies when she couldn’t even bother to get to know her daughter when she was alive? She’s a spoiled adolescent and Zoe was right about her marrying into money. If she really cared about Zoe, she would have dealt with it differently than exposing her daughter’s beliefs to the world. She would have maybe found out why Zoe believed what she did.
In the BSG pilot, I identified really strongly with Adama, Chief, Roslin, Lee, Starbuck, even Helo.
Having Amanda Greystone pull that speech stunt seems really contrived.
Zoe’s friend is overplayed by that actress.
Having Joe suddenly care about the abombination of his daughter, see her as something real and different than a freak show….seems contrived.
Another inconsistency is how the Joe Adama that adult Bill refered to with Roslin and Lee in BSG (as this amazing human rights lawyer full of integrity) hardly jives with the murder and thuggery he’s involved in. He is a mess of a character.
The fedoras are just silly.
But I will continue giving it a chance!
February 5th, 2010 at 11:40 am
LOL I feel completely the opposite about the two themes. The BSG theme did absolutely nothing for me, the only decent bit was the little crescendo through the teaser bit at the end where it showed you what was going to happen in the ep and which I had to start closing my eyes for during the third season cause it just gave too much away, but I digress. The Caprica theme on the other hand I love, it gives a nice air of mystery/intrigue, which suits the show perfectly IMO.
As for the episode itself, I really liked it, like the pilot it shows this series has promise and I just love the world they’ve created.
With the whole Amanda announcing Zoe was a terrorist thing, I just thought that she wanted to let everyone know straight away what she had just realised and grief-stricken as she was, didn’t really think about the repercussions for her or Daniel. That or she didn’t care about consequences and just wanted the truth to be known, or at least what she thought was the truth.
February 5th, 2010 at 12:11 pm
Agree with figwit. I loved BSG but always thought the theme music was kind of lame – and my roomie & I also closed our eyes during those little spoiler packed drum intros. The Caprica theme is beautiful; like I want to hear an extended cut of it. Now. ;-0)
February 5th, 2010 at 12:52 pm
[...] Source: bsgcast.com [...]
February 5th, 2010 at 2:08 pm
Hey Mat & Nat I am so happy you guys are back with CapriCast! Its been so long and its good to be able to discuss this show as its own autonomous series with people who also get the back story and the little things that relate it to BSG.
I enjoyed Rebirth, there are some things that bother me but those are mostly superficial or aesthetic, not really plot related. For instance it REALLY bothers me that young William Adama has brown eyes while the Commander he will one day become has bright BLUE! (yes, EJO donned contacts so his eyes would match Jaime Bambers’) To me it seems that if it was that important a detail to have to get a cast member as significant as EJO to don contacts they for continuity sake what the frak was going on during casting of Caprica?!! Again, not a plot thing.
Also, I really want to like Zoe, but I hope the actress than portrays her is able to evolve and seem more mature as I would assume it to be necessary to become what will be the beginning of the Cylon race (even though the final five technically exist out there somewhere, go figure)
Finally I just wanted to ask you, and hope you (and/or others) get the chance to reply, the whole “So Say You All” phrase. Everyone attributes that to EJO, however if you re-watch the BSG miniseries, that scene begins with Elosha (or perhaps another priestess) offering a prayer to the gods for the 85 deaths Galactica suffered in the initial battle with the cylons. She finishes the prayer by saying “So Say We All” to which the cast (extras and all) repeat. The reply to her is kinda weak and Adama seems bothered by the lack of conviction with which it is said and that is when he goes off on his (unscripted?) rant. So are we saying the phrase was invented by EJO or are we just saying that he went off on a tangent with it that was unscripted and made it the a bigger part of the vernacular that has become huge in the mythology of BSG?? The latter I can agree with but it was obviously scripted in advance for the other character.
February 5th, 2010 at 3:53 pm
It’s funny… Watching this I started to see a pattern that would lead the Cylons to rebel against humanity.
Zoe is considered the first fonctional “Cylon”, the first model. What is she exactly? A teenager – a teenager who is obviously growing unhappier and unhappier with the events around her. A teenager in obvious crisis and conflict (with her parents too), as many teenagers go through, even more so now that she is being used and compared to a monster. I think the best way to introduce how frightened she is, is when they open the truck’s backdoors and find the cylon struggling to get out of her bonds. I thought it was a very strong scene, reprensenting the upcoming struggle.
Now refer back to BSG (and The Plan) and how the Cylons refer themselves as “children of humanity” and how they are getting away from their “parents” clutches, and how much it sounded like it was all a big teenager’s tantrum when you finally watched “The Plan”. Is it really that strange that the Cylons rebelled when their innitial programing initiated from a teenager’s “300 gigabites” of data? And when you think about it, the original Cylon was born out of human “data”. It only makes sense that they would uncontiously strive to look and be human again.
My thoughts on Caprica is that eventually Zoe’s data will be either really corrupted (if it hasn’t already happened) or will disapear, but just enough of it will remain – rage, anger, angst, the need to be loved, to feel loved – for them to want to rebel against Humanity – or their parents.
I have to say though, I didn’t like Zoe much in the pilot. The actress has talent but she just has that something I’m not crazy about. However, she grew on me a lot more in the first episode. It’s as though she gained more confidence in herself and her ability to act and BE Zoe. I think we might get a few surprises from her in the future.
I’m also on the side of Matt about Sister Clarice’s marriage. I just thought it was a bit… overdone? I don’t know. There was a lot of sexuality in BSG, yes, but we never heard about these marriages on the show. The closest we got was Baltar’s “harem” which was looked down upon half the time. So it felt a little weird – or rather different. But then, things CAN and WILL change witihin 50 years some years.
@Bailey G. : I’m glad to know I’m not the only one annoyed by William Adama’s eyes. They were so bright and blue in BSG that they couldn’t be missed – and as you said, if EJO had to wear contacts so his eyes would be like Jamie Bamber’s, then why didn’t they do the same with this young actor? If he can’t wear contacts (because of allergies or otherwise), that’s why there’s technology, and I’m sure changing eye color digitally wouldn’t be THAT hard…?
I’m also a little ticked at, believe it or not, paper. BSG always had books (even old books) and documents with the clipped corners. What happened to that? Whenever I see Caprica and their books and papers, I see regular paper and it somehow gets on my nerves! O_O lol It IS minor, but it’s still something that, while in the background, was prominent to the BSG universe.
That we were told to watch Caprica with distance from BSG is obvious and I can live with that. But the universe WAS established and we ARE in the same universe, are we not? Even more so considering some characters from BSG are re-used, like William Adama. So what happened there? Did they not notice? Fans are watching this show too! LOL We notice these things! XD
As for EJO and “So say we all”, I think it’s mainly attributed to the fact that it was not supposed to be something prominent to the series – merely the chant of a prayer and nothing more. EJO’s unscripted rant likely made the phrase more important then it was supposed to be; not just a part of a prayer forgotten later, but a universal ralying cry that brought everyone together in times of crisis. He made it bigger then it should have been, that’s the way I see it.
February 5th, 2010 at 5:02 pm
Wow, interesting how varied the responses are to this new show. Well, let me start by saying that while the incidental or “in-show” music is frakking gorgeous (sorry, there really is no theme more beautiful or distinct than the Tauron theme on the fiddle), I agree that the Caprica credit sequence is kinda lame. And actually, not just because of the music, but also because the whole thing seemed a bit cheesy. Now I agree that while BSG also had unbelievable character themes and music woven into each episode, I absolutely hated the opening credit music (made by someone other than Bear, anyway). That is, the credit sequence AFTER season 1. The only thing I liked about it was the “Apocalypse” arrangement that Bear made for The Plan. Anyway, I honestly don’t see the appeal to the opening sequence in BSG. Even the drums, which are usually used to great effect, were in that particular context also very contrived to me, and I loathed the fact that they basically put spoilers there for the audience when a good portion of the charm and appeal of that show (to me) was in surprises. I love the Greystone theme. I don’t exacly love the arrangement in the title sequence, but it’s certainly a cut above BSGs and even most others out there (with the exception of Human Target – you guys should catch that show sometime. Bear’s work there has already matched his work on BSG, only with FULL ORCHESTRA EVERY EPISODE).
Anyway, moving on. I thought that after the mostly excellent pilot this episode was a bit of a letdown. For starters, is Amanda a frakking idiot or what?! There is a time and place for that sort of thing! You honestly expect me to believe that when she learned that her daughter MIGHT have been a terrorist, the first thing she would do is announce it to the world? She wouldn’t instead be so devastated that she would want to go straight home and weep? Or maybe determined to get to the bottom of who her daughter really was and to perhaps absolve her of blame should she have been coaxed into doing this thing by her boyfriend? I found that very, very weak.
I did, however, love the mechanic of seeing Zoe as herself in certain shots. While I thought the interchanges could have been timed better in certain scenes, it was mostly epic win. I even started to like Zoe’s character a little more (she was the only one in the pilot that I really didn’t care for). I also loved the chipper little Greystone robot, because it’s fantastic comic relief. Also enjoyed the two mechanics and their interactions with Zoe. I also very much found Joseph’s brother’s character hilarious and fun, even if he was a bit contrived.
I thought it was a little strange that single-god folks had all these multiple marriages. To me, it would have been more fitting if they were polytheists, to give fuel for the Soldiers’ attacks (and considering the general principle that most one-true-God believers also believe stoutly in traditional marriage), but it probably would have been hard to work into the plot.
I was excited about seeing Pyramid, but we didn’t get to see any gameplay. Combined with the lame anthem (sorry Bear and whoever wrote the lyrics), and I was like “ugh.” So say we all should be a Jarhead chant, not a frakkin Anthem.
Now, in response to Tootie’s remark:
Another inconsistency is how the Joe Adama that adult Bill refered to with Roslin and Lee in BSG (as this amazing human rights lawyer full of integrity) hardly jives with the murder and thuggery he’s involved in. He is a mess of a character.
I don’t agree. First off, (assuming Adama did say anything about his integrity, cause I don’t recall…all I remember is him saying “he was a better father than I was”, which doesn’t necessarily translate to his integrity) it’s a father-son thing. He may not have even told Willy about his involvement in the Tauron mafia (though that possibility seems to be fading fast). Second, one of the things this show (and BSG before it) does really well is moral relativism. Sure, Joe is in the mafia…but is he truly a bad man? I don’t believe so, and I’m sure Willy doesn’t, either. And finally, remember Romo Lampkin’s first appearance? He told Lee that Joseph taught him everything he knows about law, that he was a smart man, but he hated his guts. To me, Joseph Adama always seemed like a character who would walk the line, at the very least, if we ever got to see him…and that’s exactly what he’s doing in this show.
Now, having said that, your comment here:
Having Joe suddenly care about the abombination of his daughter, see her as something real and different than a freak show….seems contrived.
Is more or less on the mark. I think that shift could have been written in a much smoother fashion. The pilot ends with him basically disassociating himself from Greystone and telling his son that they’re going to make a fresh start. This one had him actually shouting “frak the Greystones!”, which I thought was perfectly fitting. And then, suddenly, he’s badgering Daniel about getting to see her again? Too frakkin soon, writers! I mean, I knew it was going to happen, but cripes, take your time with it! Make it believable! You need some inciting act that would get him to change his mind, and we never saw that. Weak.
And finally:
But I will continue giving it a chance!
So will I. It at least is covering some impressive ground in the intellectual realm. In fact, that’s one thing I loved about the pilot: it went were Star Trek didn’t dare to go when it introduced the holodeck.
February 5th, 2010 at 5:09 pm
By the way, who else is chomping at the bit to see the Romo Lampkin intern show up?
February 5th, 2010 at 7:05 pm
Re: Amanda not considering going through a publicist, she was in the throws of extreme loss and grief and completely overcome by shock at the discovery that her daughter might be a terrorist. She wasn’t in any kind of state to think about her image or her husband’s image, just riding on pure emotion.
February 5th, 2010 at 10:04 pm
Mixed bag. Maybe it’s me but I’m just not connecting with any of the plot threads or characters. I gave the Pilot a pass since it was setting up the characters but the first episode didn’t send the show in a clear or interesting direction where I can’t wait to see what happens next week. I hope the show can manage to pick up the pace a bit.
I did like Cylon/Zoe switch. It’s a good plot device like BSG had head six. Everything is there for a good show maybe they’ll come together in the next couple of eps.
February 5th, 2010 at 11:07 pm
Matt and Nat, glad to see this starting off in full swing.
I agree, the theme music may not be as grand as the theme of BSG, but you have to look at it like this: The theme music shows that this show is a different kind of being. It’s not “Battlestar Galactica”, though set in the same universe.
And that’s what is great about the series so far. Like you guys said about the Cylon personality splitting within a certain model, this show is the Athena to Galactica’s Boomer (or this is Caprica Six to the Pegasus’ Gina, of you prefer).
In response to the publicist thing, check the next page for my response.
Again, glad to se things on a roll again. So say we all!
February 6th, 2010 at 5:14 pm
Hey all!
I thought it was a fun episode. I loved the opening credits. Although, granted the graystone/adama theme gets alot of play in the episode, it would be nice to hear something new for the intro.
I am also waiting to see the Army of the One committing mass suicide and get downloaded into robot bodies. If that will be the case, then its not Man vs Machine anymore but as always Man vs Man.
My money is still on Bill Adama being a cylon by the end of the series. I feel something is going to happen to the kid in the coming seasons. Being that he is getting introduced to crime and all. Then Joseph will probably bring Sam and his people down on Daniel if he doesn’t rez him, just my guess. Maybe the reason for the blue eyes thing, would explain it away.
February 6th, 2010 at 7:48 pm
It is so nice to see this forum come alive again. That said, I enjoyed this episode more than I expected to. Until Friday, I was disappointed with Caprica. This episode hooked me because I also started to enjoy Zoe’s character. I think you have to like Zoe and empathize with her to enjoy this story. This is the origin story and it is based on her and her emotional journey and what she experiences.
It looks like she will be betrayed by Daniel in the future. He will be forced to discredit her memory to save his company. Amanda and Zoe were always at odds, and she caused all of Daniel’s current troubles, but Zoe thought her Dad would always stand by her. His betrayal will be heartbreakingl for her and combined with the mistreatment by human handlers that could really change her view of humanity and give insight to the ceylon hatred of humans.
The Adamas haven’t really resonated with me yet, there is so much going on there, it’s hard to see who they really are and I am not ready to give up memories of the BSG Adamas yet, I really loved those guys and I still miss BSG, but I am trying here.
I agree with not liking the fedoras. I don’t like the thirties old style look at all. It’s so much nicer at the Greystone place, all light and modern and airy. LOL
I don’t think I will ever have as much interest in these characters as I did with BSG characters, but Caprica just might be pretty good.
Anyway, it’s great to be back here, thanks Matt and Nat.
February 7th, 2010 at 9:28 am
JJ- Right on about the Amy of the One. The army of the one has a ton of potential to bring some action to the show as does conflicts between the colonies. And of course at some point we’ll see the cylons slowly start to rebel and begin the cylon war which is what everyone is waiting for. The show needed more action in the pilot and 1st episode to get everyone hooked and excited. I don’t think a train exploding was big enough to make The Army of the One feared. And Zoe’s boyfriend seems dumb if he blows himself up with Zoe and Lacy (if she didn’t get out of the train) so the AOTO has three less members instead of one less member. Didn’t make sense when I saw it.
February 7th, 2010 at 10:35 pm
First i just want to say Welcome Back Matt and Nat!!!
I loved this episode much more than the pilot and have to disagree with you about the opening theme. I thought it was pretty cool and fit perfectly with the nature of the show.
After watching your review, and idea popped into my head. What if the the Soldiers of the One were the first Cylons? In the show, Daniel needs 100,000 cylons but only has one. What if that’s what Zoe wants to do on Gemenon. Gather the STO and then they become the first Cylons. That would explain the Cylons rampant monotheism and their hatred of humanity. Just an idea.
I don’t get the big hooplah over Amanda announcing her grief at the memorial. She was hit with this big revelation and was in shock. I totally understand.
Glad your back!!!
February 8th, 2010 at 12:54 pm
Yes, EJO didn’t come up with ‘So Say We All,’ but he did some improv with that scene, which is awesome. He is an amazing actor who knows what the job entails – to own the character and his/her world…completely.
I am not surprised I’m not the only one who feels they cannot identify with any characters…they had better do something about this soon!!!
The characters are weak so far – we need to get to know them a lot more.
I think the pilot could have benefited greatly from us seeing Joseph grieving his wife and daughter a little more. I don’t know – I just don’t feel I know the guy at all.
Fascinating about the eye colour of Bill and Lee. I had no idea.
Note folks, that just because Romo says he learned everything he knows from Joseph Adama doesn’t mean he knew him. He could have just read his writings and studied him closely.
Matt and Nat, too true about the theme. Yikes!
February 8th, 2010 at 2:54 pm
look, I’ve never commented here before (that I can remember) but I have to disagree with you on the intro sequence, I thought it was really well done and bear mccreary did not disappoint.
PS: don’t know if anyone caught this but I found an easter egg in the main title sequence.
http://www.imgboot.com/image.php?u=unclesamslair&i=vlcsnap2010020813h36m55s108.png
February 9th, 2010 at 11:56 am
I don’t get the easter egg…
February 9th, 2010 at 5:56 pm
Never posted on here before. Did anyone notice Daniel playing the piano? Thought it was a clever nod to Starbuck
February 10th, 2010 at 12:13 pm
I agree with your opinion on the music/theme. I have always preferred Richard Gibbs’ to Bear McCreary. Without Gibbs setting the tone in everyway from orchestration, minimalism, theme, you would never have had any of Bears’ approach – which for me I only really adore in Season 3 during the scenes on the basestar with Baltar.
This Caprica opening theme just confirms my belief that had McCreary been responsible for BSG from day 1, we would have had a much different tone/mood that I feel would have been poorer – and frightfully as I have heard now with Caprica – akin to the mood/tone of Enterprise’s opening music *shudder*.
In short, I hate it!
February 10th, 2010 at 3:18 pm
While I disagree with Bear’s own assessment of the intro (read: FRAKKING AWESOME), I wouldn’t say it was terrible. In fact, once the percussion kicked in, I felt my foot tapping just slightly.
Musically, I think there is no better person than Bear for this type of nuanced work. Reading his blog, I gained a new appreciation for how much “source” (original, Caprican) music he needed to compose himself. Most of it is pretty decent.
Aside from the music, this episode has given me a new sense of anticipation that the pilot failed to give me. I agree with Matt + Nat: we finally have the rough outline of a plot, which is lovely.
I’m really excited for this series.
So say we all!
February 21st, 2010 at 11:32 am
@gilad the easter egg is pretty obvious. On the stone where it’s highlighted you can see the French word for family, given that this is a family drama I guess one of the FX guys decided to have a little fun with us and see if anyone noticed.